Maintenance Phase

Aubrey Gordon & Michael Hobbes

Debunking the junk science behind health fads, wellness scams and nonsensical nutrition advice.

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97 episodes
Updated Monday
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Episodes97

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Monday · 1 hr 13 min
Why Don't We Have a Surgeon General?
We’re nearly halfway through Trump's second term and we still don’t have a Surgeon General. What gives? Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! White House withdraws nomination of Janette Nesheiwat Trump’s Surgeon General Pick Distorted Key Parts of Her Résumé Dr. Janette Nesheiwat takes role at Walter Reed treating Havana Syndrome When Did RFK Jr Start Listening to Calley and Casey Means? What Casey Means and MAHA Want You to Fear Trump’s Surgeon General Pick Is Tearing the MAHA Movement Apart Trump surgeon general pick said mushrooms helped her find love The Dizzying Rise of MAHA Warrior Calley Means Casey Means Poised to Become Nation’s Top Doctor Casey Means discloses financial ties to supplement industry Laura Loomer Targets Trump’s Pick for Surgeon General The Bad Science of Good Energy Trump's Surgeon General Pick Tried to Trademark MAHA Can Trump's latest pick for surgeon general make it through confirmation? New surgeon general pick in deleted posts criticized Trump, RFK Jr Trump’s pick for SG sells supplement with ingredient banned by Pentagon Trump’s new surgeon general pick deepens MAHA-MAGA rift Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
June 10 · 53 min
Salt
In the 1980s, a low-sodium diet was seen as the gold standard for healthy behavior. In 2026, salt has been repackaged as “electrolytes” and is now cast as a core component of wellness. How did we get here? Also, an important correction: One pound of butter to one pound of potatoes is Joel Robuchon’s recipe. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! The 25 Saltiest Restaurant Meals in America Facts, Issues, and Controversies in Salt Reduction for the Prevention of Cardiovascular Disease Salt Wars The INTERSALT Study: background, methods, findings, and implications Sodium reduction Sodium Intake Reduction: An Important But Elusive Public Health Goal Effects of Diet and Sodium Intake Salt intake, stroke, and cardiovascular disease Racial and Ethnic Differences in Sodium Sources and Sodium Reduction Behaviors Among US Adults The Great Salt Debate: So Bad? Salt guidelines draw heavy backlash Sodium Reduction in US Households’ Packaged Food and Beverage Purchases Blood pressure lowering efficacy of angiotensin converting enzyme (ACE) inhibitors for primary hypertension Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
April 16 · 1 hr 8 min
Tim Ferriss’s "The 4-Hour Body" (feat. Peter Shamshiri)
We're joined by Mike's If Books Could Kill co-host to revisit a biohacking diet book for the boys. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! The 4-Hour Body Does Glycemic Index Matter for Weight Loss? An Examination of the Evidence New! Improved! Shape Up Your Life! The 4-Hour Body: The Real App You Are Working On Is An App Called Yourself Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
April 1 · 1 hr 7 min
Russell Brand Part 2
What do you do when you've flamed out as a Hollywood actor, a political commentator and a wellness guru? You make a YouTube channel. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Russell Brand accused of rape, sexual assaults and abuse Exposing Russell Brand Russell Brand And The Conspiracy Grift Russell Brand on revolution Celebrity Capital in the Political Field: Russell Brand’s migration from stand-up comedy to Newsnight “Arthur” lawsuit against Brand BBC says it received five complaints about presenter Woman says star exposed himself to her Russell Brand, Seriously How the U.S. is sabotaging its best tools to prevent deaths in the opioid epidemic Russell Brand And The Conspiracy Grift Russell Brand’s fellow travellers should defend their claims in court Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
March 17 · 1 hr 14 min
Russell Brand Part 1
Tracing the left-to-right political trajectory of the unfunniest man in British comedy. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Russell Brand accused of rape, sexual assaults and abuse Exposing Russell Brand Russell Brand And The Conspiracy Grift Russell Brand on revolution Celebrity Capital in the Political Field: Russell Brand’s migration from stand-up comedy to Newsnight “Arthur” lawsuit against Brand BBC says it received five complaints about presenter Woman says star exposed himself to her Russell Brand, Seriously How the U.S. is sabotaging its best tools to prevent deaths in the opioid epidemic Russell Brand And The Conspiracy Grift Russell Brand’s fellow travellers should defend their claims in court Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
February 12 · 57 min
The Diet Crimes of Metabolife
The rags-to-riches tale of how an illegal methamphetamine manufacturer became a legal methamphetamine manufacturer. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! How the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act of 1994 Weakened the FDA Mad About Metabolife Stimulant Propels Diet Empire The dangers of the herb ephedra - Harvard Health An Historical Review of Steps and Missteps in the Discovery of Anti-Obesity Drugs Weight Loss the Herbal Way: No All-Natural Silver Bullet Over-the-Counter-Strategy - The Washington Post Anxious Pill-Maker Puts ABC Interview on the Web A 'Neutral' Comment, a Company's Tough Reaction Metabolife Intern., Inc. v. Wornick (S.D. Cal. 1999) Ephedra hearings in the US House of Representatives Expert Panel Finds Flaws In Diet Pill Safety Study Letter Urging a Criminal Investigation of Metabolife - Public Citizen Perspective; Regulation of Dietary Drugs Is Long Overdue No Limit, for Now, on a Dieting Supplement U.S. Bans Dietary Supplement Linked to Number of Deaths Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Nov 13, 2025 · 1 hr 5 min
Raw Milk
Once widely banned, raw milk consumption is on the rise and states are repealing their bans. No one’s happier about that than the far right. How did we get here? NOTE: In the retelling of Pasteur’s early pasteurization, Aubrey misspoke! The culprit wasn’t lactic yeast, it was lactic acid bacteria. Sorry for the slip up! Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Milk!: A 10,000 Year Food Fracas U.S. Consumer survey The Effects of Pasteurization on Vitamins Lingering Heat over Pasteurized Milk How pasteurization improves safety Swill-Milk and Infant Mortality Alta Dena (Court case 1, Court case 2, Alta Dena's raw milk history) A Raw Milk Magnate Has Spent Years Fighting Public Health Agencies Should This Milk Be Legal? The Amish farmer who ignited outrage over raw milk Why Are People Promoting Raw Milk? The Quest for Raw Milk Some Raw Truths About Raw Milk Right Wing Commentators Are Pushing Misinformation How Raw Milk Went From Hippie to MAGA Here's why raw milk drinkers need to be concerned about bird flu Influencers promote raw milk Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Sep 25, 2025 · 52 min
The Food Babe
One blogger bravely pushes back against Starbucks, Subway and basic scientific facts. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Taking On the Food Industry, One Blog Post at a Time How the ‘Food Babe’ Went From Obama Ally to Trump Crusader Activist or Capitalist? How the 'Food Babe' Makes Money Latest Food Scare: What Is The 'Yoga Mat' Chemical - And Why Is It In Your Food? Almost 500 Foods Contain The 'Yoga Mat' Compound. Should We Care? Are You Eating This Ingredient Banned All Over the World? The "Food Babe" Blogger is Full of Shit Are Microwaves Safe? Global Food Security Index 2022 Differences between EU and US nutrition labels go far beyond ounces and grams Is Food Really Better in Europe? Vani Hari: How She Grew Her Food Blog Into An Empire Food blogger asks Kraft to stop using dye in mac and cheese Meet the food blogger influencing RFK Jr. Food Babe blogger Vani Hari taking heat over health science Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Aug 26, 2025 · 1 hr 18 min
Seed Oils
Why are you, as a man, afraid of sunflowers. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! The O6-O3 ratio: A critical appraisal Seed Oils: Are They Actually Toxic? No need to avoid healthy omega-6 fats Omega-6 Fatty Acids and Risk for Cardiovascular Disease Do Seed Oils Make You Sick? Seed oils: Are they healthy or harmful? ToxGuide: Hexane Dietary linoleic acid intake and blood inflammatory markers Effect of dietary alpha-linolenic acid on blood inflammatory markers Changes in consumption of omega-3 and omega-6 fatty acids The Skinny on Fats Dietary oleic acid drives obesogenic adipogenesis How Seed Oils May Be Affecting Your Body Fat and Health Stanford nutrition expert breaks down effects of seed oils The Newest Bitcoin Diet Trend Is Hating ‘Seed Oils’ Omega-6 Fatty Acids and Coronary Artery Disease The Great Con-ola Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Jul 10, 2025 · 56 min
Herbalife
We’re talking about our first diet MLM and IT’S A REAL DOOZY! Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Herbalife: Weighty Profits and Government Probes Herbalife Exec's Death Prompts Bizarre Fallout Autopsy on Herbalife founder finds death caused by accidental overdose The Uncertain Start of a Remarkable Life Nobel Prize Winner Didn't Disclose Herbalife Contract Latinos crucial to Herbalife's financial health Latino Group Demands Herbalife Probe The Big Short War The Siege of Herbalife After Big Bet, Hedge Fund Pulls the Levers of Power Herbalife Will Restructure and Pay $200 Million to Settle FTC Charges An inside look at the $200 million FTC settlement U.S. says Herbalife to pay $123.1 million to resolve China bribery case Herbalife announces new CEO to lead the L.A. nutrition company Clips! Mark Hughes' origin story Senate committee hearing Celebrity endorsement Former Herbalife Distributors Speak Out Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Jun 3, 2025 · 1 hr 11 min
Ultra-Processed Foods
Everyone agrees that processed foods are bad for you. When it comes to defining what they actually are, however, there is considerably less agreement. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Nutrition and health. The issue is not food, nor nutrients, so much as processing Ultra-Processed Foods: Definitions and Policy Issues Examining the Nova Food Classification System and the Healthfulness of Ultra-Processed Foods A new classification of foods based on the extent and purpose of their processing Ultra-processed diets cause excess calorie intake and weight gain Why Is the American Diet So Deadly? Ultra-processed foods and mortality Association of ultra-processed food intake with risk of inflammatory bowel disease: prospective cohort study Academic and doctor Chris van Tulleken: ‘Ultra-processed products are food that lies to us’ Food addiction: a valid concept? The study of food addiction using animal models of binge eating Obesity and the brain: how convincing is the addiction model? Ultra-processed foods and cardiovascular disease: analysis of three large US prospective cohorts Sugar addiction: the state of the science The Plastic Chemicals Hiding in Your Food Premature Mortality Attributable to Ultraprocessed Food Consumption in 8 Countries Ultra-processed food intake and animal-based food intake Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
May 1, 2025 · 53 min
BONUS: MAHA's First 90 Days
From our Patreon feed, we're catching up with RFK Jr. and his cadre of "Make America Healthy Again" influencers. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Mar 26, 2025 · 53 min
The Bulletproof Diet
Meet the tech bro on a noble quest to double his lifespan, improve his productivity and irritate his waitress. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Mycotoxins Myth: The Truth About Mold in Coffee Guidance for Industry: Action Levels for Poisonous or Deleterious Substances in Human Food and Animal Feed You, Only Better FTC letter to Dave Asprey Alternative medicine fans see RFK Jr. as a hero. The field’s skeptics worry. The Bulletproof Diet is everything wrong with eating in America Bulletproof Coffee: Debunking the Hot Buttered Hype Buttered Coffee Could Make You Invincible. And This Man Very Rich Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Jan 30, 2025 · 1 hr 7 min
Blue Zones
The places where humans live the longest are explained by traditional lifestyles, widespread incest or systematic fraud, there is no fourth option. Thanks to Catherine MacDonald for helping us research and fact-check this episode! Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! The global pattern of centenarians highlights deep problems in demography Late-life mortality is underestimated because of data errors Supercentenarian and remarkable age records exhibit patterns indicative of clerical errors and pension fraud Do People in ‘Blue Zones’ Actually Live Longer? They really are that old: a validation study of centenarian prevalence in Okinawa The Real Facts Supporting Jeanne Calment as the Oldest Ever Human A Population Where Men Live As Long As Women: Villagrande Strisaili, Sardinia Typologies of Extreme Longevity Myths Sardinian dietary analysis for longevity: a review of the literature Identification of a geographic area characterized by extreme longevity in the Sardinia island Specific features of the oldest old from the Longevity Blue Zones in Ikaria and Sardinia Making the Blue Zones: Neoliberalism and nudges in public health promotion Human longevity: Genetics or Lifestyle? Familial transmission of human longevity Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Dec 20, 2024 · 1 hr 12 min
BONUS: What's New With RFK Jr.?
Because we live in hell, here is last month's bonus episode about RFK Jr.'s presidential campaign with a new intro about what he could do at HHS. See you next year! Support the show
Nov 21, 2024 · 1 hr 5 min
Richard Simmons Isn't Missing
The internet gets weird investigating the "disappearance" of America's gay best friend. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey’s documentary in AU & NZ, or watch it at home anywhere else! Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Richard Simmons Show Richard Simmons, the Original Queer Eye The Grand Duke of Diet and the Clown Prince of Fitness The Sultan of Svelte The Deregulation Of Commercial Television Simmons Says Slapping Mesa Man Was Meant as Playful Richard Simmons’ Life Was a ‘Never-Ending Work in Progress’ Richard Simmons ordered to pay $130,000 after transgender lawsuit Richard Simmons' family asks Pauly Shore to please stop Pauly Shore's Richard Simmons biopic might actually be dead Richard Simmons' Death Was an 'Accident' Richard Simmons' Housekeeper of 35 Years Breaks Her Silence How eating disorders can damage the heart Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Oct 25, 2024 · 1 hr 1 min
Growing Up Richard Simmons
Before building his fitness empire, America’s most bedazzled fitness guru was a guy named Milton from New Orleans. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Watch Aubrey’s documentary in AU & NZ, or watch it at home anywhere else! Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Links! Still Hungry...After All These Years by Richard Simmons "Hair-Do" Anatomy Asylum Commercial Richard Simmons: New Orleans's hometown hero A Speedy History of America’s Addiction to Amphetamine Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Sep 12, 2024 · 55 min
The Myers-Briggs Personality Test
How a mother, a daughter and a crackpot Swiss psychologist gave us the world's most popular Buzzfeed quiz. Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Donate on PayPal Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Links! The Personality Brokers by Merve Emre Myers Briggs Type Preferences What Personality Tests Really Deliver The $2 Billion Question of Who You Are at Work Cautionary Comments Regarding the MBTI The Barnum Effect in Personality Assessment The Mysterious Popularity Of The Meaningless Myers-Briggs Why the Myers-Briggs personality test is totally meaningless Can you truly know yourself in a quiz? What You Don't Know about This Personality Test Can Hurt You MBTI, If You Want Me Back, You Need to Change Too Personality Tests Aren't All the Same The Utility of the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Jul 1, 2024 · 1 hr 3 min
BONUS: Breaking Down The Latest Anti-Trans Victory Lap
We went a little easy on the Cass Report in our last main feed episode, so we're back to [Mortal Kombat voice] FINISH HIM!!! This was supposed to be a Patreon bonus episode but we'd rather you support the lovely trans people who helped us with the research and fact-checking of this episode! Julia Serano: https://www.patreon.com/juliaserano Parker Molloy: https://www.readtpa.com/ Katelyn Burns: https://www.patreon.com/katelynburns Evan Urquhart: https://www.assignedmedia.org/support Erin Reed: https://www.erininthemorning.com/ Or organizations that work with trans youth in the UK: Gendered Intelligence: https://genderedintelligence.co.uk/ Mermaids: https://mermaidsuk.org.uk/ Stonewall: https://www.stonewall.org.uk/ Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show
Jun 18, 2024 · 1 hr 31 min
"Rapid-Onset Gender Dysphoria" Part 2: Panic! At The Endocrinologist.
Thanks to Jules Gill-Peterson (jgillpeterson.com) and Julia Serano (patreon.com/juliaserano) for help researching this episode and Evan Urquhart, Parker Molloy and Katelyn Burns for fact-checking! Support us: Hear bonus episodes on Patreon Donate on PayPal Get Maintenance Phase T-shirts, stickers and more Watch Aubrey's documentary Buy Aubrey's book Listen to Mike's other podcast Links! Origins of "Social Contagion" and "Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria" The "Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria" Controversy at AACAP's Annual Meeting Methodological Critique Of The Cass Review Methodological Critique of Littman (2018) Parent reports of adolescents and young adults perceived to show signs of a rapid onset of gender dysphoria A critical commentary on ‘rapid-onset gender dysphoria’. Foundations Of The Contemporary Anti-LGBTQ+ Pseudoscience Network Rapid-Onset Gender Dysphoria: Parent Reports on 1,655 Possible Cases Opinion: England's Anti-Trans Cass Review Is Politics Disguised As Science Tavistock v Bell Actually Nothing: The Non-Starter Non-Story of the WPATH Files As anti-trans legislation proliferates in 2024, community fears erasure from public view States Passed a Record Number of Transgender Laws. Here’s What They Say. Thanks to Doctor Dreamchip for our lovely theme song! Support the show

Maintenance Phase

Support the show

Why Don't We Have a Surgeon General?

Salt

Tim Ferriss’s "The 4-Hour Body" (feat. Peter Shamshiri)

Russell Brand Part 2

Russell Brand Part 1

The Diet Crimes of Metabolife

Raw Milk

The Food Babe

Seed Oils

Herbalife

Ultra-Processed Foods

BONUS: MAHA's First 90 Days

The Bulletproof Diet

Blue Zones

BONUS: What's New With RFK Jr.?

Richard Simmons Isn't Missing

Growing Up Richard Simmons

The Myers-Briggs Personality Test

BONUS: Breaking Down The Latest Anti-Trans Victory Lap

"Rapid-Onset Gender Dysphoria" Part 2: Panic! At The Endocrinologist.