Helping Couples Heal Podcast

110. The Abandonment Wound, Betrayal, and the Road to Healing

In this episode of the Helping Couples Heal Podcast, Marnie welcomes Scott back to the podcast to explore a personal part of recovery: the abandonment wound. Scott shares how an early fear of being unwanted, not mattering, or not being good enough shaped the way he experienced relationships, fueled perfectionism and external validation, and ultimately complicated his ability to show up for Laura after his betrayal was discovered. While Laura was navigating the pain of betrayal trauma, Scott was confronting an intense fear of being rejected and left, creating a painful cycle of pursuit, anger, distance, and repair. Together, Marnie and Scott explore why abandonment wounds can become especially complicated after betrayal, how they can distort our perception of a partner's boundaries and behavior, and why healing requires more than therapy, meetings, or simply understanding where the wound came from. Scott shares what helped him develop greater emotional regulation, take responsibility for his behavior, separate his abandonment wound from his relationship with Laura, and begin learning something he had struggled to believe for most of his life: that he matters simply because he is. This conversation is an honest look at the uncomfortable work of recovery, including accountability, self-awareness, learning to tolerate discomfort, and recognizing when old wounds are driving present-day reactions. Scott also shares what his relationship with Laura looks like today and how developing the ability to care for himself has changed their relationship in profound ways. Visit Scott’s Website and Learn More about Trident Healing Here. Click Here to Schedule a Free 15-Minute Call with Helping Couples Heal.

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109. When Needing Feels Unsafe: Understanding Dependency, Shame, and Healthy Interdependence

In this episode, Marnie explores the often misunderstood topic of dependency and how our early experiences shape the way we relate to our needs, our relationships, and ourselves. Drawing on the work of Pia Mellody and the foundations of shame resilience, she examines why asking for help can feel so difficult and how shame can keep us disconnected from the very support we need. Marnie unpacks three common dependency stances: over-dependency, anti-dependency, and the "needless/wantless" adaptation. She explains how each develops as a survival response, how each impacts intimacy and connection, and why these patterns often leave people feeling isolated, overwhelmed, or unseen. She also explores the difference between needs and wants, the role of self-care in emotional health, and what it means to move toward healthy interdependence. Through practical examples and reflection questions, Marnie offers a framework for identifying needs, communicating them more clearly, and building deeper, more authentic relationships. Click here to learn more & join The Healing Room! Download the Understanding Dependency handout and reflection questions here. Want to connect with us? Schedule your free 15-minute call.

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108. Who Are You Trusting With Your Betrayal Trauma?

In this episode, Marnie explores the importance of carefully choosing who you trust with your healing. When you have already experienced betrayal, deception, and a loss of trust, finding the right person to support you through recovery can feel scary and confusing. Marnie discusses the difference between clinical expertise, personal experience, and anecdotal advice, and why it is important to understand where the guidance you receive is coming from. Marnie also addresses healing timelines and why there is no universal timeline for recovery. She explores how comparing your healing to someone else's can create shame and make you feel like you are falling behind when, in reality, healing is a deeply personal and non-linear experience. Throughout the episode, Marnie offers practical questions to help you vet therapists, coaches, and other professionals, including specific questions about their training, experience, ongoing education, supervision, and approach to care. She also emphasizes the importance of humility, collaboration, and knowing the difference between evidence, clinical experience, and opinion. Most importantly, Marnie reminds listeners that the helping relationship should never become another betrayal. You deserve to know who you are trusting with your healing, and you deserve support that honors the complexity of what you have been through. Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute consultation.

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107. Looking Back, Living Forward: What I Didn’t Say

In this follow-up to the previous episode, Marnie revisits the conversation about grief, healing, and moving forward after betrayal. Reflecting on what she wishes she had said, she expands on two important ideas that deserve further exploration. First, Marnie discusses the reality that healing is not dependent on the outcome of your relationship. While rebuilding a relationship after betrayal is possible when both partners are committed to the work, healing and growth are also possible when the path forward leads elsewhere. She explores the fear that often accompanies both staying and leaving, and why reclaiming yourself is an essential part of the healing process regardless of the choices you make. Marnie also clarifies an important distinction between grief and grieving. While grief is the ongoing experience of loss that accompanies betrayal trauma, grieving is the active process of moving through that loss. Understanding the difference can help create more realistic expectations for healing and offer compassion for yourself as you navigate your healing journey. If you are struggling to make sense of your grief, wondering what healing might look like on the other side of betrayal, or feeling uncertain about the future of your relationship, this episode offers additional perspective on what it means to honor your losses while continuing to move forward. Want to connect with us? Click here to book your free 15-minute call.

106. Looking Back, Living Forward

In this episode, Marnie explores a painful reality of healing after betrayal: the relationship you thought you had before discovery no longer exists. While it is natural to long for the "before" and wish things could return to the way they were, holding on to that version of the relationship can sometimes keep you stuck in grief and prevent you from moving forward. Marnie discusses why healing requires grieving the loss of the relationship you believed you had, accepting the reality of what has happened, and creating space for something new to emerge. She explores the role of grief in betrayal trauma recovery, the challenges of letting go, and why acceptance is not the same as approval. Marnie also shares ways to navigate the grieving process, including identifying specific losses, honoring the version of yourself that existed before discovery, finding healthy outlets for grief, and creating intentional time to process painful emotions. If you're struggling to let go of the relationship you thought you had before discovery, this episode explores why grief is such an important part of healing and how making space for that grief can help you move forward. Interested in joining our upcoming support group for betrayed men? Click here to join the waitlist. Want to connect with us? Click here to book your free 15-minute call.

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105. Women Healing Together

On this special episode of the Helping Couples Heal Podcast, Marnie and Maddie are joined by Ally, Amy, and Shauna, who attended our first Empowered at Sea retreat. Together, they share honest reflections about what it was like to step away from daily responsibilities, prioritize their own healing, and spend a week surrounded by women who understand the pain of betrayal trauma. The conversation explores the unique experience of healing in community, the power of being seen and understood, and the relief of no longer carrying the weight of betrayal alone. They discuss the connections they formed, the courage it took to show up vulnerably, and how the retreat created space for both grief and joy to coexist. From trauma release exercises and group discussions to laughter, dancing, and unexpected moments of delight, this episode highlights an important truth: healing is not only about processing pain. It is also about reconnecting with yourself, reclaiming your voice, and remembering that joy is still possible. Whether you're feeling isolated in your healing, wondering if you'll ever feel like yourself again, or curious about the healing power of community, this conversation offers hope, validation, and a reminder that you do not have to walk this journey alone. The second annual Empowered at Sea retreat will take place August 1-7, 2026. To learn more about the retreat and register, click here. Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute call.

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104. Neuro-Difference, Betrayal Trauma, and Healing

In this episode, Marnie speaks with Candice Christiansen about navigating betrayal trauma through the lens of neuro-difference, an incredibly important topic we have not focused on before on the Helping Couples Heal Podcast. Together, they explore why traditional recovery models may not always meet the needs of individuals and couples navigating autism, ADHD, trauma, and betrayal. Candice shares both her personal story and more than two decades of clinical experience supporting neuro-different adults and couples. Together, she and Marnie explore how betrayal trauma can impact neuro-different nervous systems, why a neuro-affirming approach can be an important part of recovery, and how couples can begin understanding each other’s communication styles, sensory experiences, and expressions of empathy with clarity and compassion. Their conversation also touches on the added complexity of betrayal trauma when autism or ADHD may be present, common misunderstandings around empathy and emotional processing, and how healing often requires individualized support rather than a one-size-fits-all approach. Throughout the episode, Candice offers compassion, clarity, and hope for individuals and couples navigating betrayal trauma alongside neuro-difference, and reinforces that healing looks different for every person. Meaningful support and connection are possible. Resources Mentioned in This Episode Learn more about Candice and her work here: CandiceChristiansen.com Visit the Namaste Center for Healing here: Namasté Center for Healing Interested in Candice’s book Love, Sex & Autism? Learn more and purchase here: Love, Sex & Autism Candice mentions Embrace Autism as a helpful resource for autism education and self-screening tools: Embrace Autism Website Interested in Candice’s Autism Self-Screening Tool? Reach out to her at candice@namasteadvice.com Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute call.

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103. Consequences with Ned Fulmer

In this episode of the Helping Couples Heal podcast, Marnie sits down with Ned Fulmer, YouTuber, producer, content creator, and online personality, for a deeply honest conversation about the consequences of betrayal, what he has come to understand about its impact on his wife Ariel, and the long road of accountability and healing that follows. While much of Ned’s story became publicly known through the discovery of his affair, this conversation moves beyond the headlines and into the emotional reality of what came after. Ned reflects on the collapse of his private and public life, and the profound ways his choices impacted his marriage, his wife, his identity, and his sense of self. He speaks about what he has learned through treatment and recovery, including how denial, compartmentalization, and distorted thinking contributed to his behavior. Over time, through therapy and structured support, he began to recognize the depth of harm caused to his partner and the reality of partner trauma in a more embodied and personal way. Ned also shares what the consequences of his actions looked like in real time, including the loss of relationships, career disruption, public scrutiny, and the internal reckoning that followed. Within that collapse, he describes the beginning of a different kind of work, one centered on accountability, emotional honesty, and rebuilding a life grounded in integrity rather than image. Throughout the conversation, Marnie and Ned explore the impact of betrayal on the nervous system and identity of the betrayed partner, and what it takes for a betraying partner to begin truly seeing and understanding that level of pain without minimizing, denying, or bypassing it. If you or your partner are navigating the aftermath of betrayal and want support, we invite you to connect with our team to explore what healing might look like for you and how we can best support you in your healing journey. You can click here to book your free 15-minute call.

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102. Women Betray Too

In this episode, Marnie talks with Patty, a female betrayer, and Judith Nisenson, a betrayal trauma coach, to confront the often-ignored reality that women betray too. They dive deep into the unique patterns of female betrayal, the emotional drivers behind it, and the specific challenges women face when seeking recovery in a field traditionally focused on male betrayers. The conversation explores: Patty’s personal story: A brave and vulnerable account of a lifelong pattern of betrayal, from early childhood emotional detachment and teenage sexual trauma to two marriages and a secret sexual basement. The nuances of female infidelity: Judith discusses why women's reasons for cheating often differ from men's, highlighting themes of emotional neglect, a lack of self-identity, and the chameleon effect of morphing to fit others' expectations. The double standard of shame: A discussion on the societal and "Scarlet Letter" stigmas that create an extra layer of isolation and self-loathing for female betrayers. A roadmap to recovery: Vital resources for healing are shared, including 12-step programs (SAA, SLAA) and specialized coaching groups. Whether you are a woman or a man, a betrayer seeking to understand your own patterns or a betrayed partner navigating the trauma of betrayal, this episode offers a compassionate and honest space for healing and hope. Resources: Helping Couples Heal Services: Click here to learn more about our ongoing coaching group for female betrayers. Connect with Judith Nisenson: Visit womenswrk.com to learn more about Judith’s work with female betrayers. Join a Coaching Group: Explore Judith’s eight-week curriculum-based coaching groups for women by clicking here. Tune in to "Women Cheat Too": Check out Judith's podcast for bite-sized episodes on navigating female betrayal here. Resources for Men: To learn more about the male betrayed partners group led by Adam (Judith’s husband), click here. Want to connect with us? Click here to book your free 15-minute call

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101. Beyond Talk Therapy: Life-Changing, Somatic Self-Care Practices With Gemini Adams

In this episode, Marnie welcomes back her friend and longtime collaborator, Gemini Adams, a renowned somatic practitioner. Together, they explore a missing piece of the healing journey that many couples overlook: the body. While traditional talk therapy is vital, Marnie and Gemini discuss why cognitive understanding often isn’t enough to move couples out of the painful, repetitive cycles of betrayal trauma. Gemini shares her personal journey from living with the effects of complex PTSD and chronic conflict avoidance to finding what she calls "conflict confidence." They dive deep into the science of the nervous system, explaining why the betrayed partner is often "flooded" with sensation while the betrayer may be completely numb or dissociated. This conversation is a foundational look at the tools needed to move out of survival mode and back into what Gemini calls the "Green Zone," the place where relational connection and empathy actually become possible again. In this episode, you’ll learn: The Power of Interception: Why many survivors lose the ability to feel their own physical needs and how to begin reconnecting with their body’s cues. The Relational Nervous System: Why you literally cannot listen, retain information, or connect with your partner when you are in a state of fight, flight, or freeze. Numbness vs. Flooding: How to understand the different trauma responses between the person who caused the harm and the person who was betrayed. Building "Adult Self": How somatic skills help you stay grounded as an adult rather than being "ping-ponged" by inner-child survival responses. Triggered to Together: An introduction to Marnie and Gemini’s new program designed to help couples manage triggers and crisis moments in real-time.  Click here to learn more about the upcoming 12-week Triggered to Together programs for couples and individuals. Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute call.

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100. One Hundred Episodes of Hope

In this landmark 100th episode of Helping Couples Heal, we take a moment to pause and reflect on the journey that brought us here. Healing from betrayal is often a lonely, exhausting path, but for 100 conversations, we have walked it together. What started as a mission to bring clarity to the chaos of betrayal trauma has grown into a global community of resilient survivors and recovering couples. To celebrate our 100th episode, we’re going back to the "Why." Join us as we revisit the original mission that sparked this podcast: to provide a lifeline for those drowning in the aftermath of betrayal and broken trust. We discuss what this milestone means for our community, the lessons learned along the way, and why our commitment to your healing remains stronger than ever. We also explore the core values that have guided Helping Couples Heal since day one and why the work of healing and restoration is more important today than ever before. Whether you’ve been with us since Episode 1 or are just joining the journey, this episode is a dedication to your courage and a promise for the future of this show. Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute Zoom call.

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99. The Other Side of Betrayal: The Ten Core Wounds of The One Who Betrayed

In December, I released a podcast called The Ten Core Wounds of Betrayal, which explored the deep and lasting wounds experienced by betrayed partners. In this follow-up episode, we turn toward the other side of the rupture - the often unseen and rarely discussed wounds carried by those who do the betraying. This conversation is not about justifying or minimizing betrayal. Instead, it’s about understanding the internal landscape that often exists beneath betraying behavior. Drawing from clinical insight and relational patterns, this episode explores ten core wounds commonly experienced by people who betray - wounds that can show up in both men and women, while also acknowledging that some tend to appear more frequently in men due to socialization, attachment patterns, and emotional conditioning. By naming these wounds - such as shame, emotional disconnection, unmet attachment needs, and identity fractures - we begin to see betrayal not as random or purely selfish, but as something that often emerges from unresolved internal pain. Understanding these wounds can be a powerful step toward accountability, empathy, and meaningful repair. Whether you are a betrayed partner seeking clarity, someone who has betrayed and wants to understand yourself more deeply, or a couple navigating the long road of healing, this episode offers language, insight, and perspective to help move the conversation away from blame and toward connection, healing, and ultimately, transformation. Click here to receive your free worksheet. Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute Zoom call.

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98. The Long Road Back: One Couple's Journey Through Betrayal

In this episode, Marnie sits down with Scott and Laura, a couple who courageously share their journey of healing after betrayal. What followed Scott’s infidelity was not a quick fix or a straight path forward, but years marked by pain, rupture, and a slow, non-linear process of rebuilding trust and connection. Together, Scott and Laura reflect on the early days after discovery - when fear, confusion, and disconnection felt overwhelming - and the hard truths they had to face along the way. Laura speaks openly about her struggle with boundaries and the painful realization that she had been tolerating more than she should have. Scott shares vulnerably about his own abandonment wounds, how they fueled a sense of righteousness, and the moment he recognized he was expecting Laura to carry pain that was his to heal. They discuss the concrete steps that helped shift their relationship, including Scott joining a men’s group, learning to take responsibility for his emotional world, and the transformative impact of Imago dialogue. They also explore the power of couples recovery check-ins and the clarity that emerged through Laura’s second impact letter. This conversation offers a hopeful and grounded look at what it takes to move from living in fear and survival to standing side-by-side in honesty, accountability, and connection. For anyone navigating the aftermath of betrayal trauma, this episode is a reminder that while healing is hard, it is possible. Connect with us: Book a free 15-minute consultation call here.

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97. Navigating Betrayal Anger with Dr. Crystal Hollenbeck

In this episode of the Helping Couples Heal podcast, Marnie sits down with Dr. Crystal Hollenbeck, a therapist, trauma survivor, and author of Betrayal Trauma Anger: You’re Not Crazy, You’re Angry, and You Should Be. They explore a topic that is often misunderstood and shamed: the intense and very normal anger experienced by betrayed partners after betrayal. For too long, the clinical field has labeled this anger as “vengeful” or “unforgiving.” Crystal helps us flip that narrative, showing why anger is a natural, healthy response to the profound injustice of betrayal and an important part of the healing journey. In this episode, you will hear about: Why anger is a natural response and how betrayal creates deep emotional and nervous system reactions The S.C.I.P. Protocol, Crystal’s 4-step tool, Sit down, Calm down, Identify, and Process, for navigating triggers Anger on the brain and why it is impossible to reason through a trigger when the amygdala is hijacked Reframing for the partner who betrayed and how accountability, consistency, and presence can reduce ongoing anger Moving toward repair and how seeing anger as a signal of wounding rather than a flaw supports connection and empathy By reframing anger as a signal of wounding rather than a character flaw, couples can move from defensiveness to empathy, and from shame to true repair. Click here to download Dr. Crystal Hollenbeck’s S.C.I.P. Protocol. Click here to purchase Dr. Crystal Hollenbeck’s book, Betrayal Trauma Anger: You’re Not Crazy, You’re Angry, and You Should Be. Want to connect with us? Click here to book your free 15-minute call.

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96. Beyond Words: How Friends and Family Can Truly Support Betrayed Partners

In this deeply moving episode of the Helping Couples Heal podcast, Marnie is joined by four courageous women (Sabra, Ally, Liz, and Rachel) who vulnerably share their personal experiences navigating the aftermath of betrayal. Together, they explore a critical but often overlooked aspect of the healing journey: the complex role of friends and family. The group discusses the universal need for external support and the painful reality that loved ones often don't know what to say or how to show up effectively. From the impulse to retreat and isolate to the trauma of being judged by those closest to them, these women highlight the delicate balance between needing a "safe place to land" and requiring firm boundaries to protect their own healing process. Key topics in this conversation include: The Grey Area of Discovery: Why betrayed partners often withdraw from social circles while trying to make sense of their shattered reality. The Burden of the Fixer: How the well-intentioned advice of friends, like telling a partner to just leave, can often add to the trauma rather than alleviate it. Connection with Boundaries: Defining what safe support looks like, from the power of a meal train to the simple, profound act of sitting in silence. The Role of Support Groups: How finding a community of others who get it becomes a lifeline when family and friends fall short. Whether you are currently navigating betrayal trauma or you are a loved one seeking to support someone you care about, this episode provides essential insights into moving from judgment to empathy and from isolation to authentic connection. Download the Do's and Don'ts Guide for Family & Friends here! Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute call.

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95. The Ten Core Wounds of Betrayal

When betrayal enters a relationship, it doesn’t just break trust - it fractures a person’s sense of self, safety, and connection. In this episode, we explore the ten core wounds that betrayed partners often experience, each one carrying its own story and its own emotional truth: Worthiness Wound – “I’m not enough.” Safety Wound – “I’m not safe.” Reality Wound – “I can’t trust myself.” Control Wound – “I have to manage everything.” Belonging Wound – “I’m alone in this.” Burden Wound – “I have to carry everything.” Abandonment Wound – “You’ll leave me.” Inadequacy Wound – “I’m not as good as what I was betrayed with.” Powerlessness Wound – “I didn’t have a choice.” Trust Wound – “Trust is dangerous.” Each wound reveals a different layer of the emotional devastation betrayal creates - and each one shapes how betrayed partners think, feel, and try to protect themselves in the aftermath. In this episode, Marnie breaks down what these wounds look like in real life, how they impact day-to-day interactions, and why healing them requires understanding, patience, and consistent repair. We also talk directly to betrayers, offering a compassionate but honest framework for recognizing the impact of their actions and supporting their partner’s healing journey. This episode is an invitation to move beyond surface reactions and into the deeper emotional landscape of betrayal - where clarity, empathy, and repair become possible. This episode is an invitation to move beyond surface reactions and into the deeper emotional landscape of betrayal - where clarity, empathy, and repair become possible. Click here to download your free worksheet. This worksheet walks both partners through all ten wounds, helping identify which ones are active, how they’re showing up, and what healing might require. Want to connect with us? Click here to schedule your free 15-minute call. Visit our website to learn more about Empowered at Sea and Empowered on Land.

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94. Finding The Way Through with Jeanne Vattuone and Tim Stein

In this episode, Marnie sits down with two of her colleagues from Northern California, Jeanne Vattuone and Tim Stein to talk about Finding The Way Through, their new workbook designed to integrate sobriety, recovery, and betrayed partner sensitivity into the healing process. Purchase the workbook Finding the Way Through: A Workbook for Sex and Pornography Addiction here! Click here to join The Healing Room. Want to connect? Click here to book your free 15-minute call.

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93. Unscripted Truths: A Candid Conversation with Dr. Omar Minwalla

In what was originally intended to be a structured discussion on “The Ten Steps to Constructing the Secret Sexual Basement,” this episode took an unexpected and deeply personal turn. Instead, I’m joined by Dr. Omar Minwalla for a raw, unfiltered conversation that traces the arc of our individual and shared professional journeys. What unfolds is a rare, intimate glimpse into the foundation of a long-standing friendship - one built on mutual respect, hard truths, and a shared commitment to integrity, even when it’s uncomfortable or controversial. We talk openly about what it means to stay committed to telling the truth, to each other and to the work, despite pushback or disagreement. This was never meant to be a public conversation - but by the end, we both felt that what emerged was too meaningful not to share. I believe listeners will find resonance, insight, and maybe even a sense of companionship and loyalty in the honesty of this exchange. Dr. Minwalla will be back soon and hopefully next time we’ll get to the secret basement. Until then, this is something different… and maybe more important. Want to connect with us? Schedule your free 15-minute call here.

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92. Honoring Your Grief Without Letting It Define You

In this episode of the Helping Couples Heal podcast, Marnie explores the delicate balance of grief and hope in couples working to heal after betrayal. She shares why grief must be honored - not rushed, bypassed, or minimized - and how acknowledging the depth of loss is an essential step toward authentic healing. At the same time, Marnie reminds us that grief does not have to define your whole story. By integrating grief into the narrative of your relationship, you create space for resilience, growth, and new possibilities. This episode offers a compassionate invitation to couples: you can carry grief and hope side by side, honoring what was lost while also making room for what can still be built. Schedule your free 15-minute call Want more information on our Workshops? Click Here. Get your free reflection guide to go along with this episode here!

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91. Still Becoming: Chandler Rogers on Recovery, Marriage, and Growth (Part 2)

In this continuation of our conversation with Chandler Rogers, we dive deeper into his journey of recovery from pornography addiction and the ongoing challenges of healing within his marriage. Chandler shares honestly about what it means to keep showing up in the work of recovery—not just for himself, but for his relationship—and how hope can grow even in the midst of setbacks. We also explore Chandler’s powerful decision to create Relay, an app designed to fill in the gaps he saw in traditional recovery support. Relay was born out of his own experience and the recognition that people struggling with addiction need consistent accountability, connection, and encouragement outside of therapy or group sessions. Chandler's story is an important reminder that Recovery is ongoing. Healing from porn and sex addiction isn’t a one-time choice—it’s a daily practice of showing up for yourself and your relationship. This episode offers inspiration, practical insight, and a reminder that healing—both personally and in a marriage—is possible when we’re willing to reach for support and keep leaning into growth. Want to Learn more about Relay? Click here Connect with us by booking a free 15-minute call!

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