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Uncensored CMO

Jon Evans

The Uncensored CMO was created to explore the good, the bad and quite frankly downright ugly truth about marketing theory & practice.

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  • 27 episodes
  • weekly
  • Avg 53 min
  • English

Episodes 27

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  • #268
    June 3 · 1 hr 4 min

    How Chili’s used creativity, culture and customer experience to create one of the greatest turnaround success stories - George Felix

    George Felix, CMO of Chili’s, joins us to tell the story behind one of the most impressive brand turnarounds of recent years. From iconic menu items like chips and salsa and the famous margarita to viral social media moments and creative partnerships, George explains how Chili’s became culturally relevant again and reignited growth. Before Chili’s, George played a key role in the legendary Old Spice turnaround, and in this episode he shares the lessons he's learned from transforming legacy brands. We discuss the power of nostalgia, making the most of your agency relationships, influencing product and pricing decisions, and why the customer experience often drives more value than advertising alone. Timestamps 00:00:00 - Start 00:02:07 - The famous Chili’s chips and salsa 00:03:39 - The famous Chili’s margharita 00:06:32 - Why Chili’s has signature items 00:08:01 - How Chili’s became one of the biggest brand turnarounds in history 00:10:51 - The importance of working with people you trust 00:12:26 - George’s role in the Old Spice turnaround 00:18:10 - How to build the case for increased brand investment 00:21:16 - The power of nostalgia for a legacy brand 00:25:57 - How George pitched an idea to his creative agency and they bought it 00:29:03 - The System1 data for the Chili’s ad 00:30:45 - Fostering a great client / agency relationship 00:38:19 - How experience drives better ROI than marketing 00:42:43 - The viral cheese pull trend 00:45:45 - How can a brand create cultural relevance? 00:48:45 - Chili’s brand collaboration with Tecovas Boots 00:51:19 - How George has influence over the Product “P” in marketing 00:54:51 - How to leverage the Pricing “P” 00:57:43 - The concept of “barbell pricing” 01:00:27 - What is the most important attribute for a successful CMO?

  • #267
    May 27 · 1 hr 4 min

    Tom Goodwin and Rory Sutherland Fix Marketing (Part 2)

    Rory Sutherland and Tom Goodwin return for part two of our wide-ranging conversation on the future of marketing, creativity, and business. From driverless cars and Silicon Valley thinking, to the dangers of digitising every human interaction, Rory and Tom explore what businesses lose when efficiency becomes the only goal. They also discuss why governments need creative departments, whether we truly understand how advertising works, and how marketers can finally gain the influence they deserve inside organisations. Timestamps: 00:00 - Start 00:56 - What will be the advertising agency of the future? 10:39 - How to change the way we think about ad agencies 15:42 - Why the government need a creative department 19:44 - Creativity isn’t dead because AI only uses data from the past 22:32 - How marketers can achieve the influence they deserve 24:08 - Do we really know how advertising works? 29:29 - Is Tesla applying marketing thinking? 31:58 - The future of driverless cars and the danger of Silicon Valley 44:03 - Human interaction vs digitising everything 47:43 - Tom and Rory’s advice for CMOs

  • #266
    May 20 · 1 hr 3 min

    Rory Sutherland and Tom Goodwin Fix Marketing (Part 1)

    Two of our most popular guests return for a conversation on what’s gone wrong in modern marketing and how to fix it. Rory Sutherland and Tom Goodwin tackle everything from digital overload and bad choice architecture to the disappearance of taglines, long-term thinking, and genuine creativity. Expect behavioural science, contrarian thinking, and plenty of ideas that will make you rethink how marketing really works. Timestamps 00:00:00 - Start 00:01:31 - Digital overload - are consumers given too much choice? 00:05:51 - The power of “Easter Egg Thinking” 00:07:54 - Have hotels destroyed choice architecture? 00:10:56 - More choice reduction failures 00:14:46 - Do consumers need more choice? 00:17:45 - How ad agencies can discover real insights 00:19:21 - An idea to revolutionise Cannes 00:20:49 - Why Rory and Tom think differently 00:24:05 - What are the biggest marketing myths today 00:30:41 - Fat tailed distribution - the Dulux Dog 00:32:18 - Why we need to bring back the tagline 00:35:17 - Are marketers too young? 00:37:15 - The long term work only pays off after you’re fired 00:42:34 - How to we make companies look more long term? 00:48:03 - Why people love Ryanair but hate BA 00:49:09 - The role of surprise in advertising 00:50:43 - Is marketing actually rather easy? 01:00:49 - Is the advertising agency model broken? Thank you to our sponsor, System1: https://system1group.com/

  • #265
    May 13 · 44 min

    How to manage a crisis with ex United Airlines Chief of Comms, Jim Olson

    Jim Olson has spent his career helping businesses navigate moments of intense pressure from corporate crises to deeply personal challenges, running comms at United Airlines and Starbucks. In this episode, the author of Tailwind shares the lessons he’s learned from leadership, resilience, and facing adversity head-on. Drawing inspiration from Captain Sully’s Hudson River landing, Jim explains why the best crisis leaders follow the same process: aviate, navigate, communicate. We discuss where crisis management often goes wrong, what leaders can learn from failures like United Airlines, and why “black box thinking” matters in both business and marketing. Jim also opens up about his own cancer diagnosis and the mindset that helped him through it. Get Jim's new book, Tailwind here: https://www.amazon.com/Tailwind-Compass-Turning-Setback-Comeback/dp/B0GXCM3VYT/ 00:00 - Start 01:11 - Lessons from Captain Sully’s Hudson River landing 06:11 - The black box thinking approach to marketing 07:30 - Other crises Jim has had to deal with in his career 09:18 - When crisis management goes wrong - United Airlines 13:11 - Managing merging two cultures 15:27 - The situation when Jim’s CEO had a heart attack 18:00 - Jim’s cancer diagnosis 23:30 - The power of positive mentality 28:30 - Don’t ask yourself what if, ask yourself why not 31:34 - The power of a fourth space 34:05 - Crisis doesn’t build character, it reveals it 37:02 - Leadership lessons from Howard Schultz 38:58 - Jim’s advice for those people facing a crisis

  • #264
    May 6 · 48 min

    Marketing lessons from 20 years at Google - Dan Taylor

    Dan Taylor has spent over two decades at Google, helping shape how brands grow through search, media, and technology. Today, he leads global advertising at one of the world’s most influential companies, giving him a front-row seat to the biggest shifts in marketing. In this episode, Dan shares what he’s learned from 20 years at Google, from the importance of simplicity to navigating organisational complexity and the evolving relationship between product and commercial teams. We also dive into the future of search, including AI, new tools like “Circle to Search,” and what it all means for marketers. Timestamps 00:00 – Start 00:40 – Lessons from being a pilot 05:34 – Lessons from 20 years at Google 06:43 – How Google has changed over two decades 07:46 – The power of simplicity 09:02 – Google’s breakthrough moments 12:11 – The relationship between commercial and product 13:47 – Navigating organisational politics 17:08 – The biggest search trends in marketing 18:24 – What is “Circle to Search”? 20:37 – Opportunities for marketers in new search behaviours 24:52 – How AI is changing search 25:59 – Does Google see AI as competition? 28:09 – Will ads exist in AI search? 32:00 – How brands can improve search performance 33:42 – Making the most of Google and YouTube 35:34 – Measuring the value of brand search 39:56 – AI’s impact on creativity 45:52 – The one lesson from 20 years at Google

  • #263
    April 29 · 43 min

    How Sephora built brands through creators, partnerships and loyalty - CMO Zena Arnold

    Zena Arnold, CMO of Sephora, joins us to break down how one of the world’s most influential beauty retailers continues to set the standard for brand, community, and culture. From standout branding to record-breaking product launches, Zena shares what’s behind Sephora’s success and how the business stays relentlessly close to its customers in a fast-moving category. We explore the rise of celebrity brands, the power of loyalty, and how Sephora works with creators through initiatives like the Sephora Squad. Thank you to our sponsor, System1: https://system1group.com/ Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:13 - Zena’s incredible marketing career 06:02 - Lessons that turned Zena into the marketer she is today 07:41 - What has made Sephora so successful? 10:01 - Why Sephora’s branding stands out 11:30 - What’s trending in the beauty category in 2026? 13:22 - How does Sephora stay close to the customer? 14:45 - The biggest brand launch in Sephora history 15:25 - How to pitch a beauty brand to Sephora 18:00 - How important are celebrity brands? 19:03 - Helping brands launch in Sephora 21:00 - The power of Sephora’s loyalty programme 25:09 - How Sephora attract new customers 27:02 - How Sephora uses creators effectively with the Sephora Squad 29:45 - How to measure the effectiveness of creators 31:12 - The exceptional advertising of Sephora 32:49 - How Sephora uses tech in their marketing 38:09 - Dealing with the speed of retail 39:00 - Creating conditions where you can fail and learn

  • #262
    April 27 · 39 min

    Marketing in the age of AI with Adobe Enterprise CMO, Rachel Thornton

    Rachel Thornton, Enterprise CMO at Adobe, joins us to unpack how one of the world’s leading technology companies is navigating marketing in the age of AI. From brand building in B2B to launching complex software products, Rachel shares what it takes to drive growth at global scale. We discuss the role of major events like Adobe Summit, how AI is transforming both the practice and perception of marketing, and why community and storytelling are becoming more important than ever. Rachel also explains how Adobe balances brand and product marketing, invests in partnerships like sports sponsorships, and what “agentic orchestration” actually means in practice. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:39 - Rachel’s career and what makes a successful CMO 04:12 - The importance of brand in B2B 08:57 - The role of large events in B2B marketing (like Adobe Summit) 12:29 - The biggest changes AI have had in marketing 18:06 - How Adobe approaches community in their marketing 20:26 - How Adobe use AI in their marketing 22:53 - How Tesco use Adobe 24:22 - Adobe’s product launches at Summit 2026 26:50 - What does agentic orchestration mean? 28:33 - How to successfully launch new software? 29:58 - How Adobe addresses brand vs product marketing? 30:57 - Why Adobe invests in sports sponsorships 34:26 - The power of storytelling in sport 36:07 - The best advice Rachel has received

Showing 21–27 of 27 episodes