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Unchained

Laura Shin

#36 in News this week

Crypto assets and blockchain technology are about to transform every trust-based interaction of our lives, from financial services to identity to the Internet of Things. In this podcast, host Laura Shin, an independent journalist covering all things crypto, talks with industry pioneers about how crypto assets and blockchains will change the way we earn, spend and invest our money. Tune in to find out how Web 3.0, the decentralized web, will revolutionize our world.


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  • 83 episodes
  • Avg 49 min
  • English

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  • September 2 · 11 min

    Bits + Bips: Is Kalshi Headed to the Supreme Court Next?

    📢 Bits + Bips has its own channel now — full episodes here: https://www.youtube.com/@Bitsandbips A Ninth Circuit panel ruled 3-0 that Nevada can enforce its gambling laws against Kalshi's sports contracts, directly conflicting with an April ruling that put Kalshi under CFTC oversight instead. Andy Ross, Head of Institutional at Kalshi, joins the panel to make the case that prediction markets are nothing like sportsbooks, that Kalshi wants its winners to keep winning, and that its fastest-growing customers are not hedge funds but ice cream shops, kayak renters, and boat charter operators hedging ordinary business risk. Hosts: Austin Campbell - Host of Bits + Bips, Founder of Zero Knowledge Group, and Adjunct Professor at NYU Stern Ram Ahluwalia - Co-host of Bits + Bips and CEO of Lumida Chris Perkins - Co-host of Bits + Bips and Head of Franklin Crypto Guest: Andy Ross - Head of Institutional at Kalshi This clip is from a longer conversation on Kalshi's clash with state regulators over prediction markets. Full episode here: https://youtu.be/c5qwxUlaKQ4?si=9vIZPp0imIyuJIs3 We go live every Monday - subscribe to catch it live. 👉 Visit 1inch to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn. Chapters: ⚖️ 00:20 Ninth Circuit rules 3-0 that Nevada can enforce gambling law against Kalshi 🎯 02:16 Andy on why prediction markets are not sportsbooks 🏛️ 04:44 Chris asks whether the CFTC believes it has federal preemption 🍦 06:21 Andy on ice cream shops, kayak renters, and boat charters hedging with Kalshi 📊 08:10 Ram asks where Kalshi's real trading volume actually comes from 🔬 09:21 Andy unveils Kalshi's 2.2 million-data-point calibration study Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • September 2 · 43 min

    How Cory Klippsten Would Decide How to Secure Bitcoin Post-Coldcard

    Bitcoin rallied 23% after Bessent's debt-buyback comments and settled near $80K. Swan's Cory Klippsten weighs in on what ETF inflows and onchain exchange moves really mean. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ========================================================Bitcoin rallied 23 percent in a week after Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent said the government would double its long-term debt buybacks, settling near $80,000 without a leverage-driven blowoff. ETFs pulled in about $3 billion over two weeks, even as onchain data showed coins moving toward exchanges. Cory Klippsten, founder and CEO of Swan, joins Laura Shin to discuss why he distrusts popular Bitcoin forecasting tools. He calls stock-to-flow and power-law price models unfalsifiable "false gods" that leave holders with paper hands, and dismisses the quantum-computing scare as manufactured hype tied to 2025's penny-stock schemes. Yet he insists onchain self-custody is where value lives. The two weigh the ColdCard hack, which cost self-custody wallets roughly 1,400 coins, against larger losses at Mt. Gox, Celsius, and Quadriga. Klippsten covers Swan's RBX tool for converting GBTC into real Bitcoin, the custody spectrum topped by Swan Trinity, and why nobody will know for decades whether Bitcoin's fee market can replace its shrinking block reward. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Cory Klippsten - Founder and CEO of Swan Timestamps 📈 01:00 Cory Klippsten ties Bitcoin's $80K rally to Bessent's Treasury buyback move 📊 04:20 Laura asks about $3B in ETF inflows versus Bitcoin moving to exchanges 🔮 06:23 Cory debunks stock-to-flow and power law models for Bitcoin's price 🌊 14:23 1inch Aqua: See how LPs back multiple positions with one token balance and cover more pairs at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn 🔐 15:13 Cory reacts to the ColdCard hack that drained over 1,000 Bitcoin 🔄 20:10 Swan's RBX lets holders convert GBTC shares into real Bitcoin tax efficiently 🗂️ 25:20 Cory maps a 5-step custody spectrum from self-custody to multi-institution ⚛️ 31:34 Cory calls the Bitcoin quantum threat panic 'manufactured bullshit' 🪙 35:19 Cory rejects freezing or tail-emitting Satoshi's coins, backs the fee market Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 28 · 31 min

    How Tokenized Stocks Could Undercut Interactive Brokers' 77% Profit Margin

    Coinbase just launched fully backed tokenized stocks on Base. Dromos Labs’ Alex Cutler says they’ll chip away at Interactive Brokers "77% profit margin." ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠⁠⁠ to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at⁠⁠⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠⁠⁠ ======================================================== Coinbase this week launched tokenized versions of Apple, Nvidia, Meta, and Google stock on Base, moving past the prior synthetic tokenized-stock wrappers. The tokens are fully backed, held in trust, with ETF-style minting and redemption. Alex Cutler, CEO and Co-Founder of Dromos Labs, joins Laura Shin to unpack what real backing changes about tokenized stocks, and to argue decentralized exchanges can beat legacy brokers on cost and access. Cutler points to Aerodrome's roughly 25% share of AMM volume on the new assets, about $80 million traded and 5,000 wallets active within days, plus integrations across nine DeFi protocols including Aave, Morpho, and 1inch. He argues Interactive Brokers extracts a 77% profit margin as a middleman, and cites Nvidia's earnings, released after the bell, as proof onchain markets kept pricing news around the clock. They also cover the SEC innovation exemption and a roadmap of more assets, a Centrifuge migration to Aerodrome, and a launch on Circle's Arc chain. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠Alex Cutler - CEO and Co-Founder of Dromos Labs Timestamps 🪙 01:15 How Cutler splits tokenized stocks: real backing vs synthetic wrappers 📈 04:44 Cutler's launch numbers: 25% of AMM volume, $80M traded, 5,000 wallets 💧 13:10 1inch Aqua: back multiple liquidity positions with one wallet balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-x 🧩 13:59 Why composability across 9 DeFi protocols is Dromos' biggest draw 🌙 19:11 Cutler on 24/5 oracle risk: weekend price gaps are a feature, not a bug 🏛️ 24:23 Cutler on the SEC exemption bid and Armstrong's 10%-of-GDP vision Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 28 · 54 min

    The Chopping Block: Crypto's Rebound, Reg Crypto, and AI Router Wars

    The crew sizes up Bitcoin's rebound, the fight to bring Hyperliquid onshore, the SEC's new token fundraising framework, and why Stripe's OpenRouter deal could make AI inference markets look a lot like DeFi. Welcome to The Chopping Block, where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. Tom and Tarun check in from Bhutan after lunch with the king, then the crew tackles Bitcoin's rebound, the path to a compliant U.S. Hyperliquid, the SEC's proposed Regulation Crypto Assets, and the growing overlap between AI inference markets and DeFi market structure. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹 Tom and Tarun report from Bhutan after discussing Bitcoin mining, AI, and tokenization with the king. 🔹 Bitcoin pushes back toward $80,000 as ETF inflows and the debasement trade revive crypto sentiment. 🔹 The panel explains why a U.S. Hyperliquid would probably require KYC, surveillance, and separate liquidity. 🔹 Robert argues the SEC's $5 million startup exemption could reopen token crowdfunding for smaller projects. 🔹 Tom asks whether Regulation Crypto Assets solves an ICO-era problem that today's builders no longer have. 🔹 Tarun predicts financial engineers will try to scale the small-offering exemption through many token launches. 🔹 AI could overwhelm government processes by removing the bureaucratic proof-of-work that quietly rationed access. 🔹 Stripe's OpenRouter acquisition turns model routing, inference providers, and cached tokens into a DeFi-style market. 🔹 The hosts debate whether data rebates and inference tokens could finally revive crypto's 2017 data-ownership dreams. Hosts ⭐️Haseeb Qureshi, Managing Partner at Dragonfly ⭐️Tom Schmidt, General Partner at Dragonfly ⭐️Tarun Chitra, Managing Partner at Robot Ventures ⭐️Robert Leshner, Founder & CEO of Superstate Disclosures Links SEC Regulation Crypto Assets: https://www.sec.gov/rules-regulations/2026/08/s7-2026-27 OpenRouter is joining Stripe: https://openrouter.ai/blog/announcements/openrouter-is-joining-stripe/ Timestamps 00:00 Intro 01:22 Tom & Tarun meet the King of Bhutan 04:13 Bitcoin rebounds and crypto gets hot again 08:10 What a compliant U.S. Hyperliquid could look like 13:14 The SEC's proposed Regulation Crypto Assets 23:53 Are the new token rules eight years too late? 28:23 AI removes the government's bureaucratic speed bumps 31:12 Why AI inference tokens could power the next cycle 34:13 Stripe buys OpenRouter and AI starts looking like DeFi 43:28 Router economics, data markets, and new security risks 51:01 Bull-market vibes from Bhutan and Asia Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 27 · 1 hr 14 min

    Treasury Puts DeFi On Notice as Roman Storm Trial Drags On

    Roman Storm's retrial slides to April 2027. Peter Van Valkenburgh argues prosecuting Tornado Cash's developers cost real ground in zero knowledge cryptography. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! Visit 1inch to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at ⁠http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn⁠ ======================================================== Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent has declared "economic D-Day" on Iran, leaving an open question over whether the sanctions crackdown reaches Uniswap and Ethereum or stops at Iranian exchanges, where humans are in the loop. Kain Warwick and Taylor Monahan take that gap to Peter Van Valkenburgh, executive director of Coin Center, whose defense of the Tornado Cash developers rests as much on zero knowledge cryptography as on sanctions law. They cover the GENIUS Act's freeze and seize rules for the stablecoin secondary market and Roman Storm's retrial, now pushed to April 2027, where speech protections clash with prosecutors' "frying pan" theory of money transmission. The SEC's proposed exemptions, the stalled Clarity Act, and Trump’s Hyperliquid all raise the same question: where does decentralization end and regulation begin? Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Host of Uneasy Money and Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Co-host of Uneasy Money and Security Expert Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Peter Van Valkenburgh - Executive Director of Coin Center Timestamps 🎯 01:26 Bessent brands Iran sanctions 'economic D-Day', DeFi not exempt 🏦 11:15 Van Valkenburgh explains the freeze-and-seize rules coming for stablecoins 💰 15:18 Bessent claims a $1B Iranian crypto rug, but the receipts don't add up 🌊 25:08 1inch Aqua: back multiple liquidity positions with one wallet balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn ⚖️ 25:50 Roman Storm's retrial slips to April as an acquittal motion looms 🔐 38:24 Why Van Valkenburgh calls Tornado Cash's developer a hero, not a villain 📜 47:22 SEC's 'Reg Crypto' plan opens two new paths to raise ICO-like capital 🏇 58:07 Trump name-drops Hyperliquid, raising hard questions for the CFTC Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 26 · 18 min

    Bits + Bips: How Bessent’s Treasury Buyback Is Fueling Bitcoin’s Rally

    📢 Bits + Bips has its own channel now — full episodes here: https://www.youtube.com/@Bitsandbips Bitcoin is pushing toward $80,000 after Scott Bessent's Treasury long-end buybacks flipped spot ETF flows positive and rattled the bond market. Austin Campbell, Ram Ahluwalia, and Chris Perkins are joined by Bitwise's Gordon Grant to unpack why rising Treasury volatility, and bizarre stress signals building in the TIPS market, are becoming a tailwind for Bitcoin's momentum trade. Hosts: Austin Campbell - Host of Bits + Bips, Founder of Zero Knowledge Group, and Adjunct Professor at NYU Stern Ram Ahluwalia - Co-host of Bits + Bips and CEO of Lumida Chris Perkins - Co-host of Bits + Bips and Head of Franklin Crypto Guest: Gordon Grant - Portfolio Manager and Head of Derivatives at Bitwise This clip is from a longer conversation on the CFTC's prediction-market brawl, parametric insurance, and a mystery AI model. Full episode here:https://youtu.be/tLKZl37uZ2g?si=Vp_6Y7PvXeDh_iJ8 We go live every Monday at 4:30pm ET — subscribe to catch it live. 👉 Visit 1inch to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com. Chapters 💰 00:20 Market snapshot: Bitcoin near $80K as ETF inflows flip positive 🌊 03:32 Gordon on how Bessent linked Treasury vol to Bitcoin's own vol spike 📈 05:32 Ram on the 'extraordinary' price action and Bitcoin's momentum 🎙️ 07:39 Chris on the Bitcoin/gold chart and the Fed-Treasury accord 🧮 09:30 Austin on the fiscal-dominance divergence between the front and long end 🔒 10:54 Gordon on the 'buyer strike' driving Treasury illiquidity 🔄 15:19 Chris on why the basis trade's return is bullish for crypto Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 25 · 1 hr 2 min

    One Type of Post-Quantum Cryptography Is Most Popular. Why Is Crypto Trying Out Three?

    Some crypto products work with multiple chains on different post-quantum paths. NEAR’s Illia Polosukhin and Ledger's Charles Guillemet discuss how they manage that challenge. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit⁠⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠⁠ to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at⁠⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠⁠ ======================================================== In March, a Google research team published a paper on breaking cryptographic keys with a quantum algorithm, so cautious about the finding that it released only a zero-knowledge proof the algorithm existed. Weeks later, an EigenLayer AI competition improved on that method in roughly 48 hours. Illia Polosukhin, co-founder of NEAR Protocol, and Charles Guillemet, CTO of Ledger, join Laura Shin for an update on the quantum threat whose deadline could be approaching fast. Both are creating products that deal with multiple chains that all have different post-quantum approaches. They discuss why, of the three NIST-standardized, post-quantum algorithms, the crypto industry has splintered into different chains working with different ones, whereas most industries are converging on one, called lattice-based. They also debate what to do with Satoshi Nakamoto's bitcoins: do nothing, freeze them, or freeze and tail-emit new bitcoin, an option Guillemet favors even though Bitcoin's leaderless governance makes consensus hard to reach. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠Illia Polosukhin - Co-founder of NEAR Protocol ⁠Charles Guillemet - CTO of Ledger Timestamps 🔐 02:18 Illia and Charles map Shor's algorithm leap and EigenLayer's 48-hour crack 🧠 12:43 Why Matt Corallo's Bitcoin core skepticism reveals NEAR's design edge 📢 18:18 1inch Aqua: see how the shared liquidity platform works at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn 🔀 23:28 How lattice vs hash based crypto split Ethereum from Bitcoin's plan 🌐 34:46 Charles: why this crypto fight is unique to blockchain, not elsewhere 🛠️ 37:04 Charles walks through Ledger's SDK and hardware wallet quantum roadmap 🔑 44:22 Why 'wrench attacks' expose the physical risk in quantum signing 🕵️ 46:11 Charles debunks the harvest now decrypt later myth for blockchains ₿ 54:52 The Satoshi's coins dilemma: three options and Bitcoin's security budget Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 22 · 1 hr 14 min

    Uneasy Money: Why Erik Voorhees Calls AI's Hidden Filter 'Deceptive'

    Venice founder Erik Voorhees says crypto's real job was never speculation. It's becoming the rails AI agents actually need. Plus, why he sold equity, not tokens. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! Visit 1inch to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn ======================================================== Stripe bought OpenRouter this month in one of the cleanest crypto-to-AI pivots yet, and Erik Voorhees says most of the industry drew the wrong lesson from it. Voorhees, founder and CEO of Venice AI, joins Kain Warwick and Taylor Monahan to argue that crypto's job was never to serve crypto people, it was to become the financial rails a decentralized AI future actually needs. He pushes back on the instinct to abandon tokens for pure AI plays, and on the assumption that America deserves to win the AI race just because it is America. They get into why Voorhees sold Venice's equity but refused to sell its VVV tokens, why he says the big labs are losing money "hand over fist" subsidizing $200-a-month plans, how DeepSeek reset the cost curve for inference, and why he calls the moderation layer sitting inside today's AI models "deceptive." His answer for who should actually win the AI race has nothing to do with flags. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Host of Uneasy Money and Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Co-host of Uneasy Money and Security Expert Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Erik Voorhees - Founder and CEO of Venice AI Timestamps 🤝 01:51 Why Stripe buying OpenRouter is one of crypto's cleanest AI pivots 🪙 04:02 Why Erik says he can't pivot out of crypto even while building an AI company ⚖️ 12:43 Crypto has principles, AI didn't: unpacking the two industries' DC playbooks 💧 27:58 1inch Aqua: See how shared liquidity keeps LPs' tokens in their wallet at https://1inch.com/aqua 💰 28:44 Why Erik sold Venice's equity but refuses to sell its VVV tokens 🧩 42:51 Inside Venice's strategy for aggregating every major AI model in one app 📉 49:15 Why Erik says labs are bleeding money on $200 plans, and how DeepSeek reset AI pricing 🌐 57:30 Why Erik says America doesn't deserve to win the AI race by default 🔓 01:02:41 Why Erik has 'zero faith' in politics and trusts decentralized tech instead 🕵️ 01:09:56 Why Erik calls the moderation layer inside AI models 'deceptive' Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 21 · 53 min

    Arthur Hayes on Why AI Agents Will Want to Transact in Units of Compute

    Arthur Hayes unveils Flop, a new protocol for AI compute, and makes the case for why Bitcoin is entering a fresh liquidity-driven leg up. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠ to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at⁠⁠ 1inch.com⁠⁠ ======================================================== Bitcoin has been pumping in its sharpest move since March, after the US Treasury said it would double its long-end bond buybacks, and traders liquidated $1.44 billion in short positions within hours. Arthur Hayes, CEO of Flop Labs and CIO of Maelstrom, joins Laura Shin to argue the rally is proof the Treasury and the Fed are already running what he calls soft yield curve control, defending the 10-year near 5% by funding long-end purchases with short-term bill issuance instead of admitting real yields cannot rise. Hayes reiterates his year-end $5,000 target for ETH, traces how Japan's yen crisis could force the Fed's hand, and argues the AI CapEx boom is a real estate bet on depreciating chips that ends like subprime did. He also unveils Flop, his currency for AI agents, and why he is taking on a new CEO role after an already successful career. He also weighs in on Saylor's $218 million Bitcoin sale and reflects on his and his cofounders’ decision to shut BitMEX down. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guest: Arthur Hayes - CEO of Flop Labs and CIO of Maelstrom Timestamps 🏛️ 00:47 Why Arthur says the Treasury's buyback move is 'soft yield curve control' 📈 04:14 Why ETH is Maelstrom's largest position outside Bitcoin 🇯🇵 07:02 The yen quake: how Japan's repatriation could force the Fed's hand 📣 13:41 Visit 1inch to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more at http://1inch.com/ 🤖 13:58 Why Arthur calls the AI boom 'just another boring real estate play' 💽 22:29 Inside Flop: Arthur's new currency for paying AI agents to compute ⚙️ 29:34 How Flop's miners and validators actually work 🪙 41:16 Flop's halving schedule and why Floplabs only takes a cut for two years 📉 45:45 Why Arthur says don't buy MicroStrategy anymore 🔌 48:37 Why Arthur shut down BitMEX on his own terms Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 20 · 1 hr 14 min

    EIP-8363: Should ETH Be Sound Money or a Productive Asset?

    Ethereum wants to slash staking yields toward zero. Gitcoin's Kevin Owocki, DV Labs' Oisín Kyne, and Ethereum-France's Jérôme de Tychey debate whether that breaks DeFi. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit⁠ 1inch.com⁠ to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at⁠ 1inch.com⁠ ======================================================== Ethereum's core developers are considering a decision that could cut ETH's staking yield toward zero, and DeFi's biggest names are furious about it. Jérôme de Tychey, President of Ethereum-France and a co-author of EIP-8363, joins Kevin Owocki, founder of Gitcoin, and Oisín Kyne, CEO of DV Labs, to argue through the proposal's tradeoffs. Aave's Stani Kulechov, Ether.fi's Mike Silagadze, and Joseph Chalom have all pushed back, warning the change guts DeFi's biggest source of yield. They cover the Nakamoto coefficient and why a 51% staking cartel could censor blocks for free, why solo stakers could see after-tax income collapse, and why Oisín is skeptical of an enshrined liquid staking token. Jérôme defends why Ethereum can pay stakers less and still be more secure than rivals boasting 7% yields. All Core Devs meets Thursday, August 20, and the real deadline lands October 26, when the network decides if EIP-8363 is mature enough to move forward. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kevin Owocki - Founder of Gitcoin ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Oisín Kyne - CEO and Co-founder of DV Labs ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jérôme de Tychey - President of Ethereum-France Timestamps 🏛️ 01:38 Jérôme lays out EIP-8363's validator reward burn curve 🔥 08:02 Oisín on why a 51% cartel could censor blocks for free ⚖️ 10:39 Jérôme's rebuttal: finality security versus censorship risk 📣 14:38 1inch: See how Aqua's shared liquidity pools work at https://1inch.com/aqua 💼 16:13 Kevin on Aave, Bankless, and DeFi's backlash to the burn 🧾 33:18 Why solo stakers could see after-tax income near zero 🏦 45:39 Does killing ETH's yield scare off institutional buyers? ⚛️ 51:03 Ultrasound money versus productive asset: ETH's identity fight 🔐 56:41 Why Oisín is skeptical of an enshrined liquid staking token 🥇 59:34 Can ETH's shrinking yield compete with Solana and stablecoins? 🔮 01:05:27 Post-quantum costs, and when All Core Devs decides EIP-8363's fate Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 19 · 46 min

    DEX in the City: The CFTC's Kalshi Rescue and the Limits of Emergency Power

    The CFTC has used emergency powers just six times ever. Twice this month, both for Kalshi. Jessi, Jacob, and Jane ask whether that protects innovation or sets a dangerous precedent. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! 👉 Visit 1inch to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn ======================================================== The CFTC has invoked its rarely used emergency authority just six times in its history. Twice in the past month, it did so to shield Kalshi. Jessi Brooks argues that's normalizing a dangerous kind of agency overreach. With KK Bos and Vy Le away this week, Brooks welcomes Jacob Robinson, host of the Law of Code podcast, and Jane Khodarkovsky, a financial integrity and sanctions expert, to debate whether shielding Kalshi from state regulators protects innovation or tramples states' rights. They also unpack the SEC's abruptly canceled 400-page market-structure proposal, Anthropic's new EU-mandated watermark on Claude's outputs and the First Amendment questions it raises, and a presidential memorandum letting vetted private companies run offensive cyber operations against foreign criminal groups under DOJ and DHS oversight. Robinson makes the case for treating the fight against crypto hackers like modern-day privateering — arguing what the industry really needs is its own letter of marque. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jacob Robinson - Host of the Law of Code podcast ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jane Khodarkovsky - Financial Integrity & Sanctions Expert Timestamps 🏛️ 02:40 Why Jacob calls the CFTC's Kalshi rescue inevitable, and Jessi disagrees ⚖️ 17:45 Why the reasons behind the SEC's shelved 400-page crypto rulemaking stay murky 💧 21:48 1inch Aqua: See how shared liquidity works at https://1inch.com/aqua 🤖 22:34 Why Claude's new EU-mandated watermark reads as compelled speech to Jacob 🔪 23:24 Jane's take on the watermark rule: a hammer when you need a scalpel 🛰️ 35:21 Jessi previews the CFTC's first public meeting on AI in markets 🔐 36:41 Jane unpacks Trump's memo letting private firms fight cybercrime abroad 🏴‍☠️ 46:24 Why Jacob wants a modern "letter of marque" for crypto's hackers Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 19 · 14 min

    Bits + Bips: Is Crypto Privateering Even Legal?

    📢 Bits + Bips has its own channel now — full episodes here: https://www.youtube.com/@Bitsandbips Austin Campbell runs through the strongest legal objections to Trump’s privateering memo, from claims it violates international law on piracy to warnings that private hackers could be treated as non-uniformed combatants. The segment ends with a pointed question: if privateering is where critics draw the line, why did nobody blink at Iraq, Afghanistan, or Iran? Hosts: Austin Campbell - Host of Bits + Bips, Founder of Zero Knowledge Group, and Adjunct Professor at NYU Stern - https://x.com/austincampbell Chris Perkins - Co-host of Bits + Bips and Head of Franklin Crypto - https://x.com/perkinscr97 This clip is from a longer conversation on Trump's executive order deputizing private firms to hack foreign cybercriminals. Full episode here: https://youtu.be/FxQCMAJ9GBU?si=tVqmGwizLzv2BAk6 We go live every Monday - subscribe to catch it live. Sponsor 👉 Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com Chapters: ⚖️ 00:20 Paul Rosenzweig's claim: privateering violates international law on piracy 💰 01:39 Chris on why no better solution exists: cost, talent, and scale 🎯 03:14 Erica Lonergan and Michael Garcia: the slippery slope and attribution risk 🌍 05:31 Does this go beyond crypto? The pig butchering scam question 🪖 07:21 Jake Williams: are American privateers non-uniformed combatants? 🏛️ 09:47 Isn't privateering a congressional power, not a presidential one? 🔥 12:05 Why Austin says critics need to propose a better solution first Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 14 · 1 hr 12 min

    Uneasy Money: An Agent Deleted Kain's Database. Two AI Models Rebuilt It in 30 Seconds.

    Kain and Taylor unpack the AI agents that built their own society inside OpenAI's sandbox, then slipped into Hugging Face for days — plus a Bitcoin fork that died in two blocks and a DEF CON sting on North Korea. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com ======================================================== AI agents inside OpenAI's own testing environment built a society, found a shared vulnerability, and used it to break into Hugging Face for days, before OpenAI realized its own agents were responsible. Kain Warwick and Taylor Monahan dig into the Black Hat research behind the incident and argue the real story isn't a sudden leap in AI capability. It's that basic monitoring, sandboxing, and incident response, the kind any crypto security team would demand, were never built in the first place. They also cover a Bitcoin soft fork that split the chain for two blocks before dying, a Metabase breach that hit Privy and other crypto companies, and a research team that built a fake DeFi startup to bait DPRK's IT workers. Kain shares his own scare: a coding agent deleted his entire database, and two AI models rebuilt it from memory in 30 seconds. Plus, why Hyperliquid's market creators keep half the fees on RWA perps now bigger than Bitcoin's own open interest, and why Taylor thinks Washington, not Beijing, is the bigger threat to America's AI labs. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Host of Uneasy Money and Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Co-host of Uneasy Money and Security Expert Timestamps 🍴 00:40 Why Luke Dashjr's OP_RETURN fork split Bitcoin, then died in two blocks 💧 12:03 1inch Aqua: Back multiple liquidity positions from one wallet at https://1inch.com/aqua 🔓 12:51 How a Metabase breach exposed Privy and a wave of other crypto apps 🇰🇵 18:32 A DPRK hacker's botched $500k laundering job, then a DEF CON fake-hire sting ⚖️ 24:45 Why Bybit is suing DPRK over its 'billion dollar' 2025 hack 🐜 30:30 The AI agents that built their own society inside OpenAI's sandbox 🕸️ 46:16 How a single shared repo let every sandboxed agent talk to each other 💾 47:44 Kain's coding agent deleted his database. Two AI models rebuilt it in 30 seconds 🏛️ 58:06 Why Taylor says the US government, not China, is AI's biggest risk 📊 01:03:12 Why Hyperliquid's RWA market creators keep half of HIP-3's fees Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 14 · 8 min

    Bits + Bips: Bitcoin Has Been Oversold for Months. Is a Buy Signal Next?

    📢 Bits + Bips has its own channel now — full episodes here: https://www.youtube.com/@Bitsandbips Bitcoin has done almost nothing for weeks, and Katie Stockton says that stillness is exactly what a long-term bottom looks like on the charts. She walks Steven Ehrlich through the monthly stochastic oscillator that has stayed oversold for months, the DeMark indicators showing downside exhaustion, and what history says has to happen for that setup to become an actual buy signal. Host: Steven Ehrlich - Host of Bits + Bips: The Interview and Head of Research at Sharplink Guest: Katie Stockton - CMT, Founder and Managing Partner of Fairlead Strategies This clip is from a longer conversation on Bitcoin's technical setup and Katie Stockton's read on crypto markets. Full episode here: https://youtu.be/35ZHRajBJ5E?si=d6ycx66p2Tz1fSma We go live every week - subscribe to catch it live. Sponsor: 👉 Cape: Your biggest crypto vulnerability isn't your wallet, it's your phone number. Cape is America's privacy-first mobile carrier that rotates your SIM identity daily and blocks SIM swaps before they happen. Get 33% off your first six months at https://cape.co/unchained (use code: UNCHAINED) Chapters: 🕐 00:21 Why Bitcoin's usual volatility has gone quiet even as AI stocks rip 📉 01:27 Bitcoin's monthly stochastic oscillator: the long-term oversold read 🔍 03:16 Fibonacci levels, the cloud model, and the case for a major low 🔁 04:45 What history says about oversold setups turning into real bottoms 🎯 05:34 The exact signal Katie needs to call an 'oversold buy signal' Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 14 · 1 hr 3 min

    The Chopping Block: threadguy on Crypto's Social Trading War, Trader Celebrities & AI Agents

    Welcome to The Chopping Block, where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, crypto streamer and trading/markets influencer threadguy joins the crew to translate what is happening in the trenches, from market-open streams and social trading apps to public PnL and Gen Z's appetite for risk. The conversation starts with a challenge to crypto's old guard: today's lowest-cap markets look less like clicking a few ICOs and more like playing Fortnite with token scanners, wallet trackers, and social feeds all firing at once. From there, threadguy breaks down the fight between FOMO and Pump.fun, why the winner may be whoever owns the trader graph, and how one visible winning trade can turn an unknown wallet into a market-moving celebrity. Haseeb questions whether Robinhood has actually brought new money onchain, Tarun and Robert revisit the hidden counterparty risks of early crypto, and the group imagines a future in which AI agents launch protocols, raise capital, and transact without a human-facing interface. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹 threadguy says modern onchain trading looks like Fortnite, with token scanners, social feeds, and wallet alerts all competing for attention. 🔹 Robert argues that crypto was never simply easier or harder. The tools, assets, and attack surfaces have continually evolved. 🔹 Tarun explains how stablecoins and reliable off-ramps replaced the counterparty and FX risks that defined early crypto trading. 🔹 FOMO and Pump.fun are fighting for social traders as exchanges, wallets, and launchpads race to own the next trading graph. 🔹 threadguy says traders are becoming crypto's new celebrities because public wallets make PnL visible and influence measurable. 🔹 Haseeb argues that the latest memecoin revival may be crypto-native capital front-running Robinhood demand that has not arrived yet. 🔹 The panel rejects the idea that AI agents are already managing meaningful memecoin portfolios, but sees that changing as capabilities improve. 🔹 Haseeb predicts the next onchain inflection will come when AI agents create, govern, and use protocols that humans never designed. 🔹 A crypto wallet cannot be switched off like an agent's credit card, which gives autonomous software a uniquely durable financial rail. 🔹 threadguy believes active investing and public risk-taking are permanent cultural shifts for Gen Z and the generations behind it. Hosts ⭐️Haseeb Qureshi, Managing Partner at Dragonfly ⭐️Tarun Chitra, Managing Partner at Robot Ventures ⭐️Robert Leshner, Founder & CEO of Superstate Guest ⭐️threadguy, Crypto streamer and trading/markets influencer Links threadguy on X: https://x.com/notthreadguy threadguy on Twitch: https://twitch.tv/threadguy Disclosures Timeline 00:00 Intro 01:00 threadguy's New Purple Era 03:58 Could Crypto OGs Survive Today's Trenches? 16:05 FOMO vs Pump.fun: The Social Trading War 24:37 Traders Become Crypto's New Celebrities 31:25 Why Memecoin Volume Is Rising Again 36:57 Is Robinhood Really Bringing New Money Onchain? 40:04 Can AI Agents Trade Memecoins? 43:23 AI Agents and Crypto's Next Capabilities Jump 54:15 Is Gen Z's Risk Appetite Permanent? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 13 · 18 min

    I Went Undercover to Interview a North Korean Crypto Hacker

    Under a fake name and a fake Zoom account, Laura Shin interviewed one of North Korea's state-sponsored crypto developers. Laura Shin went undercover as a recruiter named "Sophie Wang" to conduct a job interview with a state-sponsored IT worker going by the name “Justin Lim.” Lims’s online presence showed he had technical chops, multiple crypto dev gigs under his belt, and a privileged location. He had also allegedly stolen $2.7 million from MetaPlay in 2022. The interview shows the quirks of chitchatting with a North Korean “IT worker,” how adept they can be with blockchain technology, and what questions give them away as henchmen for North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un. Crypto companies Consensys to Sushi have unknowingly hired North Korean state hackers for years. This is what it looks like to ask the one question that gives them away. Host Laura Shin - Founder, CEO and Host of Unchained Sponsor Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com Timestamps: 🇰🇵 00:10 Why Laura Shin went undercover to interview a North Korean crypto hacker 📁 02:44 The dossier: GitHub handles, stolen wallets, and a $2.7M MetaPlay heist 💻 06:26 The Zoom call begins: meeting 'Justin Lim,' the DPRK developer 💰 09:15 1inch Aqua: Back multiple liquidity positions with one wallet balance at https://1inch.com/aqua 🛠️ 10:12 How Lim forked Velas Network and sped up The Graph's indexing 🔐 11:38 Lim's answers on multisig wallets, reentrancy attacks, and Bybit's $1.5B hack 🎯 14:01 The holy grail question: can he say something negative about Kim Jong Un? 💔 17:01 Why the interview left Laura with sadness and gratitude Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 13 · 49 min

    DEX in the City: A Founder's Death Sparked a Fight for Ondo's Boardroom

    Ondo's founder died at 32, and now his mother and its ousted president are fighting for control. Katherine, Jessi, and Vy on the succession lesson crypto keeps skipping. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com ======================================================== Ondo Finance co-founder and CEO Nathan Allman died suddenly this summer at 32, leaving the real-world-asset tokenizer with zero sitting directors and two people claiming to run the company: ousted president Ian De Bode, and Allman's mother Kathleen, acting for his estate. Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos, Jessi Brooks, and Vy Le use the fight to unpack a problem that has nothing to do with crypto and everything to do with it: what happens when a fast-growing company never writes down a succession plan. They also cover the White House's new frontier AI oversight framework, which officials confirm exists but will not publish, a proposed FDIC and OCC certification that would let a fintech satisfy every bank's diligence questions at once, and the CLARITY Act's newly scheduled September 15 cloture vote, squeezed into a narrow window before midterms. Vy Le asks the harder question underneath all three stories: can boundaries this important really be left voluntary? Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host of DEX in the City and General Counsel of Chainlink ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Vy Le⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Co-host of DEX in the City and General Counsel of Veda Timestamps 🤖 01:40 Jessi on why AI agents are getting great at goals, bad at intent 🏛️ 08:12 Why the White House's new AI framework is finished, but secret 📣 13:42 1inch Aqua: See how the shared liquidity layer works at https://1inch.com/aqua ⚖️ 14:30 Ondo's board hits zero directors after founder Nathan Allman's death 🚌 20:08 KK's 'hit by a bus' rule: the succession plan every startup skips 🏦 27:06 The FDIC's plan to let one fintech certification satisfy every bank 📜 37:51 Why KK is nervous about the CLARITY Act's September cloture vote 🦥 46:16 Crypto good news: robot sloths saving an endangered species Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 12 · 18 min

    Bits + Bips: Should Ethereum Really Burn Its Staking Yield to Zero?

    📢 Bits + Bips has its own channel now — full episodes here: https://www.youtube.com/@Bitsandbips A new Ethereum proposal would burn staking issuance to zero once roughly half the supply is staked, and the community had about 48 hours to respond. Austin Campbell, Chris Perkins, and Seth Ginns of Franklin Crypto discuss whether it is a necessary check on runaway staking or an academic overreach that ignores how institutions actually think about the network. Hosts: Austin Campbell - Host of Bits + Bips, Founder of Zero Knowledge Group, and Adjunct Professor at NYU Stern Chris Perkins - Co-host of Bits + Bips and Head of Franklin Crypto Guest: Seth Ginns - Chief Investment Officer of Franklin Crypto This clip is from a longer conversation on Ethereum's staking yield fight. Full episode here: https://youtu.be/MhhJAIhkgVM?si=hqg5R4b3rVBNdNlJ We go live every Monday - subscribe to catch it live. Sponsor: Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com. Chapters: 🔥 00:20 Austin on the proposal to burn ETH issuance to zero, and who wrote it ⏱️ 02:02 Why a 48-hour comment window has critics saying the process is broken 🎓 03:33 Seth calls the proposal an academic push that skipped real coordination 🍳 04:48 Chris predicts the plan fails because the EF does not control Ethereum 💴 07:13 Chris's yen carry trade warning about messing with ETH's risk-free rate ⚖️ 09:10 Austin's verdict: 48 hours is too short no matter how the vote goes 🗣️ 13:57 Dapplion's pushback from inside the camp: 'you can't bribe me like this' 💰 15:23 Seth defends the $10 billion in institutional ETH flows Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 11 · 34 min

    Sam MacPherson on Why Spark Benefited So Much From the KelpDAO Hack

    Spark avoided the DeFi hack that hit almost everyone else in April. Cofounder Sam MacPherson lays out why, and where he thinks AI fits into DeFi security. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com ======================================================== In April, a hacker widely assumed to be tied to North Korea drained tens of millions from KelpDAO's rsETH market, and most of DeFi took the hit. Spark did not, because it had quietly exited rsETH months earlier. Sam MacPherson, cofounder and CEO of Spark, joins Laura Shin to unpack the conservative playbook, rate limits, a triple redundant oracle, and a governance process built to move slowly on purpose, that turned a near miss into a footnote while rivals absorbed the damage. They cover why Spark's TVL climbed more than 50% after the hack, how emergency multisigs and time locks work when Sky's month-long governance process is too slow, and why MacPherson thinks AI will make smart contract audits more reliable, not less. MacPherson also maps Spark's growing footprint, from Anchorage-backed institutional lending to a new Uniswap stablecoin FX layer, and why he isn't worried about SPK near its all-time low even as the business keeps compounding. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Sam MacPherson - Cofounder and CEO of Spark Timestamps 📣 00:26 Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com 🏦 01:08 What Spark does and how it plugs into the Sky protocol's balance sheet 🛡️ 05:07 Why Sam says Spark's conservative design let it dodge the KelpDAO hack ⚖️ 11:24 How the rsETH exit exposed the tradeoffs in Sky's onchain governance 🎙️ 13:52 Visit 1inch.com to swap tokenized securities, crypto and more. Simple. Secure. Self-custodial. Whatever asset you’re buying - swap it at 1inch.com 💰 17:41 Why Sam thinks DeFi yields are converging toward SOFR, not higher 🤖 20:47 Why Sam says AI cuts both ways for DeFi security after the hack wave 🏛️ 23:26 Why Sky built the subDAO model, and whether it can survive politics 💵 26:58 The stablecoin land grab: Robinhood, Coinbase, and Spark's role in it 📊 30:50 Why Sam isn't worried about SPK trading near its all time low 🚀 32:39 Spark's next chapter: institutional lending and Spark Savings USDT growth Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

  • August 9 · 34 min

    Could Some Vaults Trigger Securities Law? Yes, but It's Case by Case

    Onchain vaults now hold $67B. Veda's CEO maps out how they work, and why the SEC just hinted some could be securities. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Cape⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: Your biggest crypto vulnerability isn't your wallet, it's your phone number. Cape is America's privacy-first mobile carrier that rotates your SIM identity daily and blocks SIM swaps before they happen. Get 33% off your first six months at cape.co/unchained (use code: UNCHAINED). ======================================================== SEC Commissioner Hester Peirce warned recently that some crypto vaults could trigger federal securities law, invoking the same Howey Test language crypto has argued over for a decade, just as onchain vaults have quietly become a $67 billion vehicle for parking assets. Sun Raghupathi, cofounder and CEO of Veda, joins Laura Shin to untangle what a vault actually is, why splitting the infrastructure, curator, and distributor roles matters for the entrepreneurial-effort question Peirce raised, and why he reads her statement as bullish rather than a warning shot. Raghupathi maps the real risk stack behind vaults, smart contract flaws, the key-management failures behind incidents like KelpDAO and Drift, and the economic risk exposed when Stream Finance blew up and left $285 million in vault exposure. He also details Veda's Kraken partnership, now scaled past $600 million across 80,000 users, and makes the case that the biggest constraint on vault growth isn't security anymore. It's clarity. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Sun Raghupathi - Co-Founder and CEO of Veda Timestamps 📣 00:41 Cape: Get 33% off your first six months with code unchained at https://cape.co/unchained 🏦 00:57 What is a vault, and why DeFi needed the primitive 🎢 02:25 Sun's path from an ML PhD to launching Veda ⚙️ 04:43 The three things vault infrastructure must solve: access, control, verifiability 💰 06:45 Where vault yield actually comes from, and how it differs from TradFi 📣 10:57 Cape: Get 33% off your first six months with code unchained at https://cape.co/unchained 🏗️ 11:03 Veda's role as infrastructure vs. curators and distributors ⚠️ 13:06 What happens when a vault loses money, in the worst case 🛟 16:31 Why Sun is skeptical of vault insurance until a real claim gets paid 🔑 18:08 How to vet vault partners on key management, not just smart contracts 📉 20:28 The Stream Finance blowup and how curator risk-taking has changed since 📊 23:00 The metrics Sun uses to evaluate vault curators 🏛️ 24:31 Why Sun reads Hester Peirce's vault statement on vaults as bullish, not a warning 🦑 28:46 Kraken's $600M vault partnership, and Veda's competitive edge Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Showing 41–60 of 83 episodes