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The Transition Tapes
International Sustainable Finance Centre (ISFC)
The funky podcast for the people making finance sustainable and financing sustainability.
The world already has a lot of podcasts. What it does not have is a podcast that combines challenging interviews, Desert Island Discs and deep insights into the cultural, political and professional hurdles of sustainable finance and how they are overcome by experts (AKA humans!).
Hosted by Hugh Wheelan, award-winning finance journalist with 25+ years experience and a media entrepreneur. He was the co-founder of Responsible Investor in 2006.
https://www.isfc.org/the-transition-tapes
- 14 episodes
- Avg 42 min
- English
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May 25 · 54 minEpisode 12 | Jakob Thomä: Silicon Boundaries: why the social and regulatory pushback on AI could ‘strand’ some of today’s massive tech investment bets?
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, we speak with, Founder & CEO of Theia Finance Labs and Professor in Practice at, about the huge risks embedded in today’s overwhelming investment focus on AI and tech — and how social and regulatory pushback could ‘strand’ some of the sector’s biggest investment bets. Together with Hugh Wheelan, they explore: the “silicon boundaries” we may already be crossing - and the societal and environmental costs involved where the data on these issues can be found, and what it reveals the growing evidence of societal and regulatory resistance to AI and tech expansion what investors should be doing now to finance a more humanly responsible future Jakob also shares his Transition Tapes playlist — described as “absolute chaos musically and stylistically” — featuring Nina Simone, TLC, Tupac, Gala, Duman and more. Here's his Transition Tapes playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/4BKFjIl6ZzTFRFKl3XDD4a?si=KOtbVYH4TZu490AWI2pb3Q
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S1 · E11April 29 · 39 minEpisode 11 | Harald Walkate - Rethinking sustainable finance narratives
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, we speak with Harald Walkate, Advisor on Financing Sustainability & Blended Finance at Route17 and Senior Advisor at the LSE. We explore the idea of “reference narratives” - the stories that shape how we think about sustainable finance. These narratives can spread quickly, reinforce themselves, and influence decisions, even when they don’t fully reflect reality. We discuss: • what reference narratives are and why they matter for sustainable finance • why market-led narratives have become dominant • why policy-led approaches often receive less attention • how current policy initiatives compare in terms of real-world impact Harald is also a pianist and composer, performing with his jazz group The New York Second. And explore his Transition Tapes playlist, along with his curated selection of favourite books, films and podcasts. Spotify playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5hjfiUtmCJGQZCte08c8rG?si=YDGHEBmjS9KqgKV9Btu5uw
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S1 · E5April 15 · 39 minEpisode 10 | Justine Leigh Bell - How to assess and price transition risks in the bond market
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, we speak with Justine Leigh-Bell, CEO of the Anthropocene Fixed Income Institute (AFII). Together, we explore the growing importance of transition risk in the $150 trillion global debt market — and the tension at the heart of sustainable bond labelling in the context of the climate transition. We discuss: how AFII approaches research on the real-world sustainability impact of bond issuance why investors should think beyond labels and focus on outcomes where the European Green Bond Standard fits into the broader landscape how government bonds could play a role in hedging transition risk, including the case for sovereign transition linkers Justine also shares her Transition Tapes playlist — a top house party selection — along with her favourite books, films, and podcasts. 🔗 Spotify playlist
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April 1 · 44 minEpisode 9 | David Carlin - Rules, risks, and the energy transition
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, Hugh Wheelan speaks with David Carlin, founder of D. A. Carlin and Company, a New York-based sustainability advisory firm, and Visiting Research Fellow at King’s College London, where he focuses on the intersection of sustainability, economics, and finance. In the conversation, they explore the current global landscape of climate and sustainability regulation, and what it means for the energy transition. Among the topics: how policymakers and regulators are approaching the development of realistic and pragmatic rules for businesses how companies and investors are navigating the evolving international regulatory environment which economic sectors are experiencing the most significant transformation driven by climate and sustainability pressureswhich reporting and risk frameworks are most relevant today, for whom, and how they may anticipate future regulations? He also shares his Transition Tapes playlist - a selection of some of the finest musical storytelling from the rock n’ roll canon. 🔗 Spotify playlist
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March 2 · 41 minEpisode 8 | Catherine Howarth - Turning shareholding into action
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, Hugh Wheelan with Catherine Howarth, OBE, Chief Executive of ShareAction, the European NGO that pushes for ambitious standards in responsible investment. Catherine also serves on the board of NEST pensions, is a member of the Financial Conduct Authority’s advisory committee on sustainable finance and of HM Treasury’s Asset Management Taskforce. In the conversation, they discuss ShareAction’s latest campaigns and the broader debates shaping the future of responsible investment. Among the topics: how and why ShareAction is campaigning for more pension fund mini-publics as Nest, the giant UK pension fund, carries one out itself what ShareAction’s major shareholding voting recommendations are for 2026, and why? the pushback on physical AGMs and why ShareAction is fighting against it air pollution: an under-discussed issue with major public health ramifications, and tightening policy and legal frameworks Catherine reflects on how she and her team stay motivated amid increasing ESG pushback and political headwinds. As for every Transition Tapes episode, she shares her favourite music - an eclectic mix of country, classical and folk with an undercurrent of social struggle: 🔗 Apple 🔗 Spotify
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S1 · E7February 16 · 52 minEpisode 7 | Rob Bauer: Sustainable investing…belief or evidence?
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, Hugh Wheelan talks with Rob Bauer, Professor of Finance at Maastricht University, Chair in Institutional Investors, and Director of the European Centre for Sustainable Finance (ECCE). With extensive experience researching and advising pension funds and institutional investors, Rob brings an evidence-based perspective on how sustainability and climate risk are actually understood — and acted upon — in investment decision-making. Drawing on new empirical research, Rob cuts through assumptions about investor behaviour to explore what pension fund members want, how professional investors think about climate risk, and when shareholder engagement really delivers value. He also reflects on the commercial and structural barriers that continue to limit investor collaboration. Hear Rob talk about: what pension fund members expect when it comes to sustainability what research shows about investor beliefs on climate change the evidence on investor engagement and its impact why collaboration among investors remains so difficult Beyond markets and models, Rob shares his interests in history, politics and music — including the tracks that make up his Transition Tapes playlist, spanning new wave, post-punk and indie. Don’t miss Rob’s recommended reads, podcasts, series and his favourite tunes: 🎵 Playlist: Spotify Playlist Apple Playlist 📚 Books: Hilary Mantel - Wolf Hall Peter Buwalda - Bonita Avenue Donna Tartt - Secret History Jan van Aken - De Ommegang 🎙️ Podcasts: De stemming (Dutch politics) Heavyweight: Great and fun podcast about life (by Jonathan Goldstein) 📺 Series/movies: Game of Thrones The Leftovers One battle after another
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January 21 · 45 minEpisode 6 | Rory Sullivan: ESG backlash - what’s real and what isn’t?
In this episode of The Transition Tapes, Hugh Wheelan talks with Rory Sullivan, CEO and Co-Founder of Chronos Sustainability and a leading global expert on climate change, human rights, and sustainable finance. With over thirty years of experience across public policy, investment management, and advisory roles, Rory brings a clear-eyed perspective on where ESG stands today, and what serious investors should focus on next. At a time of growing backlash and confusion around sustainable finance, Rory cuts through the noise to separate substance from rhetoric and sets out what credibility, collaboration, and long-term purpose really mean. Hear Rory talk about: What the ESG backlash really is and what it isn’t Which investor collaborations still matter now the “tide has gone out” How asset owners can clarify long-term, intergenerational purpose Why sustainable finance needs a return to Economics 101 on materiality, incentives, and regulation Beyond markets and policy, Rory also shares his love of books, how he works through writer’s block, and the music that fuels his thinking, captured in his Transition Tapes playlist. Listen to the episode on: 🔗 Apple 🔗 Spotify Don’t miss Rory's favourite Transition Tapes playlist. 🎵 Spotify Playlist 🎵 Apple Playlist
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S1 · E5January 8 · 46 minEpisode 5 | Helena Viñes Fiestas: Taxonomy, SFDR & the Future of EU Green Finance
Helena Viñes Fiestas is Commissioner of Spain’s financial markets authority (CNMV) and was recently reappointed as Chair of the EU Platform on Sustainable Finance. She has been at the heart of Europe’s sustainable finance architecture since its earliest days, helping to shape the EU’s approach to taxonomy, disclosure, and transition planning. In this episode of The Transition Tapes, Helena joins Hugh Wheelan for a wide-ranging conversation on where EU sustainable finance stands today — and where it goes next. Drawing on her unique “inside track” perspective, Helena reflects on how Europe’s green finance framework has evolved, the realities of policy simplification, and the challenges of maintaining ambition amid political and market pressure. Hear Helena talk about: How the different pieces of EU sustainable finance policy - from the Taxonomy to SFDR - fit together, and how they are beginning to influence real-world capital expenditure toward net-zero business models. How the role of the EU Platform on Sustainable Finance has evolved as a multi-stakeholder advisory body, and what to expect from its next mandate. The Omnibus simplification process, why simplification matters, and where the risks of politicisation and regulatory rollback lie. Common misconceptions around SFDR, what it can realistically deliver, and what comes next in its review. Beyond policy, Helena also shares how books, travel, music, and good food shape her thinking and provide balance alongside the demands of financial regulation. Don’t miss Helena’s favourite reads and her Transition Tapes playlist. Spotify Playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1PeAruu9nxk8SDogYDrJ6A?si=9vaISo--QTilK9819BtUEw Apple Playlist: https://music.apple.com/gb/playlist/helena-vi%C3%B1es-fiestas-the-transition-tapes/pl.u-EdAVz8YIX4lxP8
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S1 · E4Dec 2, 2025 · 51 minEpisode 4 | Lisa Sachs: Reality checks on sustainable finance thinking
Lisa Sachs is Director of the Columbia Center on Sustainable Investment, part of the Climate School at Columbia University in New York. She is also the author of a smart and trenchant set of reality check articles on LinkedIn. In the latest episode of The Transition Tapes, Lisa talks with Hugh Wheelan about why she’s challenging thinking on sustainable finance and how a renewed vision can help re-shape the future of sustainability planning. Hear Lisa talk about: How a positive impact vision of laws and governance could shape finance, investment flows and practices, and renew positive multilateralism. Why sustainability reporting has become a frustrating ‘end’, rather than a means, due in part to the risk focus of Mark Carney's Tragedy of the Horizon’s speech 10 years ago. The challenge of bringing scientists, engineers and financiers together for co-ordinated planning for public goods. Why sustainable finance is like trying to pilot a broken plane through turbulence, and why it’s painful to watch failed radar for climate finance now being applied with gusto to biodiversity! While Lisa loves many types of music for dancing and relaxing, she also talks about why music has taken on a therapeutic role for her in a world of daunting sustainability challenges! Don’t miss her top ten Transition Tapes playlist! Spotify Playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1NgBEFWhN8gpDUsqqDqEkp?si=J9K_jhsqQZq_vEDHQrWBsg Apple Playlist: https://music.apple.com/gb/playlist/the-transition-tapes-lisa-sachs/pl.u-r2yB1aBu9B18pv
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S1 · E3Nov 18, 2025 · 43 minEpisode 3 | Nell Minow: The serious threat to shareholder voting in the US on climate and sustainability risks, and beyond
In the third episode of the Transition Tapes, HughWheelan talks with Nell Minow, who BusinessWeek called "the queen of good corporate governance" and Fortune magazine dubbed "the CEO killer". Minow is Chair of ValueEdgeAdvisors, Co-founder and Director of GMI Ratings, and a former President of ISS. This is a crucial time for shareholder rights in the US financial system, which are under heavy attack from regulators in Texas and other states, in moves which, if successful, could neuter climate and sustainability proxy voting. What some people may not know is that Nell is also a total movie buff, and for years has written a magazine column under the moniker of the Movie Mom. Check out her great corporate governance movie references! Hear: Nell talk about the origins of the business model of proxy voting agencies. How shareholders getting directors with climate change expertise nominated to the board of ExxonMobil precipitated the latest devastating attack on shareholder rights. How Nell defended proxy voting agencies in front of the US Congress. What the implications of the regulatory attack on shareholders rights could be? Nell’s favourite ‘corporate governance’ movies, her Transition Tapes music playlist, and career advice. Nell's Transition Tapes Playlist: Spotify Apple music
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S1 · E2Nov 7, 2025 · 39 minEpisode 2 | Sean Kidney: From zero to trillions in green bonds…how?
In the second episode of The Transition Tapes, we’re talking with Sean Kidney, CEO and Co-founder of the Climate Bonds Initiative about its theory of change, and the scaling of an organisation that helped birth a market of trillions of assets in climate and sustainability bonds. How does that actually happen? Sean explains how his interest in using finance to lower costs for critical societal issues became a catalyst for change. His driving principle: "Follow the Money", get finance to decide it has to change, then look for ways for the money to express itself. Hugh Wheelan challenges Sean on a crucial question: if green bonds have scaled to trillions, why are CO₂ emissions still rising? Sean also reveals where the only reported green bond scam happened (you might be surprised), and shares how simple net-zero planning incentives could turbocharge the green bond market for property development. Beyond the work, we explore Sean's preferred books, his Transition Tapes playlist and the career advice he offers to the next generation of sustainability leaders. Sean's Transition Tapes playlists: Spotify Apple Music
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#1Oct 29, 2025 · 49 minEpisode 1 | Mark Campanale: The carbon bubble and stranded assets…when?
In this first episode of The Transition Tapes, Mark Campanale, founder of Carbon Tracker, walks us through his career, the origin story of Carbon and Planet Tracker, and the Theory of Change behind it, on unburnable carbon and stranded assets. He reflects on how a month stranded in the desert sparked a lifelong mission to connect sustainability with economic history and finance. He also shares his view on the EU Green Taxonomy and why he believes it's "a solution looking for a problem." Beyond the work, we explore Mark's Transition Tapes playlist - from Latin rock and Neapolitan songs to UK folk blues, US psychedelia, and even a Mahler symphony - and the career advice he wishes he’d received earlier. Mark's Transition Tapes playlists: Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5arQoUvyvEomCbf7QZyYn0?si=8_X7YKTISEKJkfRbnuA_3w Apple: https://music.apple.com/gb/playlist/mark-campanale-the-transition-tapes/pl.u-EdAVzMbtX4lxP8 Tracks from Mark's playlist: Spring Manifestations, Santana O Zampugnaro: O Sarrasino The Associates, Party Fears Two Album Kind of Blue, Miles Davis (first track) Solid Air, John Martyn Gong, Masterbuilder Jefferson Airplane - House at Pooneil Corners Dean by Terry Reid; Milk and Honey by Sandy Denny Stabat Mater, Vivaldi Mahler, Symphony No5, the Adagietto ‘Reflection’ by the Pentangle
- TTOct 15, 2025 · 20 sec
The Transition Tapes - Trailer
The world already has a lot of podcasts. What it does not have is a podcast that combines challenging interviews, Desert Island Discs and deep insights into the cultural, political and professional hurdles of sustainable finance and how they are overcome by experts. (AKA humans!). As well as going deep on their professional fields of expertise and the current global sustainable finance context, we will really get to know our guests by asking: What books and movies do you love? And why? What music is the soundtrack to your life? What music do you work to, dance to, get romantic to, get inspired by? Guests will compile a Spotify/Apple Music playlist that will be linked to the pod: their compilation tape! What is the advice that you wish somebody had given you at the start of your career in sustainable finance? What advice would you give to others in the ESG field?