EducationScienceSocial Sciences

The Science of Learning

Keith Sawyer

The Science of Learning explores what research tells us about how people learn—and how we can learn better.

In each episode, Dr. Keith Sawyer, the Morgan Distinguished Professor of Educational Innovations at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, and the editor of The Cambridge Handbook of the Learning Sciences, talks with leading researchers about the science of learning. These conversations go beyond myths and trends to focus on evidence-based insights from cognitive science, neuroscience, and the learning sciences.

The podcast examines how learning really works: from memory and attention to social interaction, embodiment, and the design of learning environments. Episodes connect rigorous research to practical implications for teaching, education, and everyday life.

Guests include many of the most influential scholars in the field, offering a rare opportunity to hear directly from the people shaping how we understand learning.

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12 episodes
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S1 · E11
September 8 · 53 min
Can an Entire Society Learn? Educational Reform in Thailand with Paulo Blikstein and Deborah Fields
What would it mean for an entire society to learn? Most research on learning focuses on individuals—students learning in classrooms, employees learning at work, or people learning new skills. But learning scientists Paulo Blikstein and Deborah Fields have spent years documenting something much more ambitious: a 25-year experiment in Thailand that brought new ideas about learning into schools, villages, farms, factories, and communities. Their new book, The Society That Learns, tells the story of what happened when ideas from constructionism—associated with Seymour Papert and MIT—were introduced in Thailand in the late 1990s. Rather than simply importing an American educational model, Thai educators and communities adapted these ideas to their own culture and circumstances. Prefer video? Watch the full video interview on YouTube: https://youtu.be/i4J3zWuejKY In this episode, we hear remarkable stories of villages using learning to address debt and water shortages, teachers reinventing their classrooms, and factory technicians learning to identify problems before they shut down production. We also discuss some of the larger lessons from this 25-year experiment. Why does lasting educational change take so long? Why do reforms often fail when they're imposed from the top? What happens when teachers are treated as creative professionals and given the freedom to experiment, fail, reflect, and try again? And how can ideas move among individuals, schools, workplaces, and communities until learning becomes a characteristic of an entire society? Blikstein and Fields argue that successful innovation isn't about finding a model that works and copying it everywhere. It's about giving people the agency and support to adapt ideas to their own circumstances—and to learn their way through the problems they encounter. Paulo Blikstein is a professor at Columbia University whose research focuses on constructionism, educational technology, making, and computing education. Deborah Fields is a learning scientist whose research explores learning across settings, with particular attention to identity, culture, technology, and participation. Their new book is The Society That Learns. You can watch the full YouTube interview as part of The Science of Learning YouTube playlist. Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Copyright ©️ 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E10
August 25 · 57 min
Roger Azevedo: Why AI Isn't Enough—The Science of Metacognition and Learning
Artificial intelligence is transforming education—but can an AI tutor really help students learn? In this episode of The Science of Learning, Keith Sawyer talks with learning scientist Roger Azevedo, one of the world's leading researchers in artificial intelligence, metacognition, and self-regulated learning. Watch the video interview on YouTube: https://youtu.be/wYQ3r6iE-l0 Roger explains why simply giving students access to ChatGPT or another powerful AI system is not enough. Effective learning depends on understanding what's happening inside the learner's mind. Roger describes decades of research developing intelligent tutoring systems that adapt to individual learners by monitoring their knowledge, attention, motivation, and emotions. He explains how AI can become a true learning partner by building a cognitive model of each student and providing personalized guidance in real time. They also discuss: Why today's generative AI still lacks a true model of the learner What metacognition is—and why it is essential for effective learning How students can become better self-regulated learners Multimodal learning analytics, including eye tracking and facial-expression analysis AI tutors that adapt instruction to each student's needs Simulated learners and digital twins as the future of educational technology How AI may eventually help students understand their own thinking Whether you're a teacher, student, researcher, or simply interested in how AI will shape education, this conversation offers an insightful look at the future of learning—and why the human mind remains at the center of that future. Guest: Roger Azevedo, Professor, University of Central Florida Host: Keith Sawyer Watch the full video interview on YouTube: https://youtu.be/wYQ3r6iE-l0 Subscribe to the Substack newsletter: https://keithsawyer.substack.com The Science of Learning explores the latest research on how people learn, featuring conversations with the world's leading learning scientists, cognitive psychologists, and education researchers. Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Copyright (c) 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E9
August 11 · 55 min
Janet Kolodner: How the Learning Sciences Began
How did the learning sciences become a distinct field of research? What inspired scholars from psychology, education, cognitive science, and artificial intelligence to create an entirely new discipline devoted to understanding how people learn? In this episode of The Science of Learning, host Keith Sawyer talks with Janet Kolodner, one of the founders of the learning sciences. Watch the video interview on YouTube: https://youtu.be/8OEeAQbyo_Y Janet shares the story of the field's origins, beginning with her pioneering work in artificial intelligence and case-based reasoning in the late 1970s and 1980s, and continuing through the founding of the Journal of the Learning Sciences, the first International Conference of the Learning Sciences, and the International Society of the Learning Sciences (ISLS). The conversation explores why traditional laboratory research could not fully explain learning in authentic settings, and how researchers came together to study learning as it occurs in classrooms, museums, communities, workplaces, and everyday life. Janet also discusses several of the field's most influential ideas, including cognitive apprenticeship, design-based research, funds of knowledge, Learning by Design, project-based inquiry science, and the emerging field of learning engineering. Whether you're a researcher, educator, graduate student, or simply curious about how people learn, this episode offers a firsthand account of how one of today's most influential interdisciplinary fields was created—and where it is headed next. For more interviews with leading learning scientists, visit The Science of Learning YouTube playlist About Janet Kolodner Janet Kolodner is Professor Emerita at Georgia Tech and Boston College. She was the founding Editor-in-Chief of the Journal of the Learning Sciences, a co-founder of the International Society of the Learning Sciences (ISLS), and a pioneer of case-based reasoning, Learning by Design, project-based inquiry science, and learning engineering. Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Copyright (c) 2026 Keith Sawyer
July 28 · 14 min
How Science Happens—Inside the 2026 International Society of the Learning Sciences Conference
In this special documentary episode of The Science of Learning, I take you inside the 2026 International Society of the Learning Sciences (ISLS) conference at the University of California, Irvine. Watch the full video documentary on YouTube at this link Rather than focusing on technical research presentations, this documentary explores the human side of science—the conversations, friendships, creativity, and sense of community that make scientific discovery possible. You'll hear from many of the world's leading learning scientists as they reflect on why they come to ISLS, what learning means to them, and why collaboration across disciplines is essential for advancing our understanding of teaching and learning. The documentary explores four themes: Why learning scientists are motivated by curiosity and purpose How scientific communities are built through collaboration and connection Why interdisciplinary perspectives lead to new discoveries How the arts and creativity are becoming an increasingly important part of learning sciences research Thank you to the International Society of the Learning Sciences, the conference organizers, and everyone who generously agreed to participate in this documentary. If you'd like to experience the visuals from the conference—including the campus, artwork, performances, and community that inspired this episode—you can also watch the full documentary on The Science of Learning YouTube podcast. Episode Topics The International Society of the Learning Sciences (ISLS) Educational research Cognitive science Interdisciplinarity Scientific collaboration Academic conferences Creativity and the arts Community in science Music by license from SoundStripe: "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "The Wild" by Alsever Lake "Cedar Sun" by Rest & Settle Copyright (c) 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E7
June 30 · 48 min
Why Students Don't Like School | A Conversation with Daniel Willingham
Why do students find learning so difficult? According to cognitive psychologist Daniel Willingham, it's because the human mind isn't designed for thinking. Instead, our brains are designed to avoid thinking whenever possible by relying on memory, routines, and past experience. And yet, true learning requires and deep and effortful thinking. Watch the video interview on YouTube: https://youtu.be/DWSn3km6lCc In this episode of The Science of Learning, I sit down with Dan Willingham, professor of psychology at the University of Virginia and author of the influential book Why Don't Students Like School?, to explore what decades of cognitive science reveal about how people learn. We discuss why knowledge is the foundation of understanding, why background knowledge is essential for reading comprehension, and why teaching critical thinking can't be separated from building deep knowledge. Dan talks about curiosity, scientific thinking, creativity, and the relationship between knowledge and expertise. Our conversation dives into the really big questions: how students develop understanding and why learning is often more difficult than we expect. Most of all, this episode offers practical insights for teachers. Whether you're a teacher, professor, student, parent, or simply curious about how the mind works, this episode offers a fascinating introduction to the cognitive science of learning. About Daniel Willingham Dr. Willingham is Professor of Psychology at the University of Virginia. His research focuses on the application of cognitive psychology to K–16 education. He's the author of numerous influential books, including Why Don't Students Like School?, Outsmart Your Brain, When Can You Trust the Experts?, and The Reading Mind. About The Science of Learning For video interviews with leading researchers on learning, education, creativity, and cognitive science, subscribe to The Science of Learning YouTube playlist. For audio interviews, you can find The Science of Learning on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and all podcast platforms. Copyright © 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E6
June 16 · 38 min
How Great Teachers Help Students Figure Things Out for Themselves | Joe Krajcik
How do students learn without the teacher simply giving them the answer? In this episode of The Science of Learning, Keith Sawyer talks with learning scientist Joe Krajcik about project-based learning, scientific modeling, curiosity, and the role of productive struggle in deep understanding. Watch the video interview on YouTube Krajcik explains why lasting learning happens when students actively construct knowledge for themselves rather than memorizing facts or copying answers. Through carefully designed experiences, teachers can help students build models, ask meaningful questions, test ideas, and connect new concepts to what they already know. The conversation explores: Why learning requires more than asking questions—it requires figuring out answers How teachers provide scaffolding without taking over the learning process The role of firsthand experiences in building understanding Why scientific models are powerful tools for explanation and prediction How students learn to make claims supported by evidence and reasoning The importance of curiosity and question asking in both learning and creativity Examples of project-based learning from elementary and high school science classrooms Along the way, Krajcik shares memorable examples involving squirrels, skateboards, water quality, chemistry, and the famous question: "How come I see so many squirrels, but I don't see any stegosaurus?" Learning happens when we build knowledge, not when we receive it. This episode explores how great teachers help students construct understanding that lasts. For more information Dr. Krajcik is a professor emeritus at Michigan State University and one of the leading researchers in project-based learning and science education. His work has helped shape contemporary approaches to inquiry-based science instruction and the Next Generation Science Standards. Dr. Krajcik's web site The Science of Learning is produced and hosted by Keith Sawyer. Music by license from SoundStripe "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Copyright (c) 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E5
June 9 · 50 min
Howard Gardner on Intelligence, Creativity, and the Future of Learning
Howard Gardner is one of the most influential educational psychologists of the past half century. Best known for his theory of Multiple Intelligences, Gardner has transformed how educators think about intelligence, learning, creativity, and human potential. Watch the YouTube video interview: https://youtu.be/DX9811c4lJI Subscribe to the Substack newsletter: https://keithsawyer.substack.com In this episode, Gardner reflects on the origins of Multiple Intelligences theory, explains why IQ scores capture only a narrow range of human abilities, and discusses what intelligence really means. He traces the development of his ideas from studies of brain damage and cognitive development to his work at Harvard University's Project Zero. Our conversation also explores the relationship between intelligence and creativity, the role of the arts in human development, the concept of the "synthesizing mind," and the profound challenges that artificial intelligence poses for education and society. Topics discussed include: What intelligence is—and what it isn't The strengths and limitations of IQ tests The theory of Multiple Intelligences Brain research and human cognitive abilities Project Zero and learning through the arts Creativity and innovation Ethics and human responsibility Artificial intelligence and education The future of colleges and universities What learning scientists should know about AI Howard Gardner is the John H. and Elisabeth A. Hobbs Research Professor of Cognition and Education at the Harvard Graduate School of Education. In 1967, he was a founding member of Harvard Project Zero (HPZ), a research group focused initially on understanding the nature of artistic knowledge,; but one which now covers a wide range of educational and epistemological issues. For 28 years, with David Perkins, he was Co-Director of Harvard Project Zero, and in more recent years has served in a variety of leadership positions. He is the author of more than 30 books, including Frames of Mind, Creating Minds, Five Minds for the Future, and A Synthesizing Mind. Gardner's work has shaped educational practice around the world and influenced generations of teachers, researchers, and policymakers. This conversation explores not only his most famous ideas but also the broader questions that have guided his career: What is intelligence? What makes people creative? And what will remain uniquely human in an age of increasingly powerful AI? Gardner's current work can be followed on these four sites: · HowardGardner.com · TheRealWorldofCollege.com · MultipleIntelligencesOasis.org · TheGoodProject.org Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Photo credit Jay Gardner, 2025 Copyright © 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E4
June 2 · 44 min
Why You Forget What You Learn — And the Science of Making Learning Stick | Henry Roediger
Why do we forget so much of what we try to learn? Why do techniques like rereading, highlighting, and cramming often fail? And what does cognitive science tell us about how learning really works? In this episode of The Science of Learning, Keith Sawyer talks with cognitive psychologist Henry Roediger, co-author of the million-selling book Make It Stick. Roediger explains one of the most important discoveries in the science of learning: we do not learn best by repeatedly putting information into memory — we learn best by actively retrieving it. The conversation explores: why rereading and highlighting create "illusions of learning" the science behind retrieval practice and spaced learning why testing can improve learning rather than simply measure it how mental models and conceptual understanding develop why stories and elaboration improve memory what teachers can do differently in classrooms how these principles apply beyond school, from medicine to the workplace Roediger also discusses classroom studies showing dramatic improvements in student learning, the origins of Make It Stick, and how the science of learning is now influencing fields ranging from medical education to Navy SEAL training. Henry Roediger is one of the world's leading researchers in cognitive psychology and human memory. He is Professor Emeritus at Washington University in St. Louis. The Science of Learning is produced hosted by Keith Sawyer, Morgan Distinguished Professor of Educational Innovations at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. Copyright (c) 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E3
May 26 · 52 min
Why Understanding Requires the Body, Not Just the Mind | Mitch Nathan
We often think of learning as something that happens entirely in the mind. But according to learning scientist Mitchell Nathan, learning is fundamentally grounded in the body. In this episode of The Science of Learning, Dr. Keith Sawyer talks with Mitchell Nathan about embodied cognition—the idea that thinking and learning are deeply connected to physical experience. From simple everyday actions to advanced mathematical reasoning, our bodies play a central role in how we understand the world. Nathan explains why students can follow procedures without truly understanding them, and how meaningful learning depends on connecting abstract ideas to lived experience. He shares research on gestures, movement, and perception, showing how the body reveals—and even shapes—our thinking. The conversation also explores broader implications for education, including how we teach mathematics, how we assess learning, and how emerging technologies like AI may support—or undermine—deep understanding. Watch the full video on YouTube: https://youtu.be/tOoQVK0K1Rc Key topics Why learning is grounded in physical experience The difference between procedural knowledge and conceptual understanding How gestures reveal hidden thinking Embodied approaches to teaching mathematics The role of material interaction in innovation and discovery What embodied cognition means for AI and digital learning Key takeaway Learning is not just about performing tasks—it's about making meaning. And meaning emerges when we connect new ideas to our embodied experience in the world. Learn more Watch the full video on YouTube: https://youtu.be/tOoQVK0K1Rc Subscribe to The Science of Learning for more conversations with leading researchers on how people learn. Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Produced and hosted by Keith Sawyer Copyright (c) 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E2
May 19 · 42 min
Most Learning Happens Outside of School | Barbara Rogoff
What can schools learn from the ways people learn outside of school? In this episode of The Science of Learning, Keith Sawyer talks with developmental psychologist and learning scientist Barbara Rogoff about the sociocultural approach to learning and development—one of the most influential perspectives in the learning sciences. Rogoff's research emphasizes that learning is fundamentally social and cultural. Children learn not only through formal instruction, but through participation in families, communities, workplaces, and everyday activities. The conversation explores how learning happens through collaboration, observation, apprenticeship, and guided participation. The discussion explores: Why learning is fundamentally social How children learn through participation in communities Culture and human development Guided participation and apprenticeship What schools can learn from families and communities Why many forms of learning are invisible in traditional schooling Sociocultural approaches to education Barbara Rogoff is Distinguished Professor of Psychology at the University of California, Santa Cruz, and one of the foundational scholars in sociocultural theories of learning and development. YouTube video interview: https://youtu.be/NgTDfliTcVY Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Produced and hosted by Keith Sawyer Copyright © 2026 Keith Sawyer
S1 · E1
May 12 · 43 min
Why Technology Hasn't Improved Learning | Chris Dede
Why haven't computers transformed education the way people expected? In this episode of The Science of Learning, Keith Sawyer talks with Harvard professor and learning scientist Chris Dede about why technology has so often failed to improve schools—and what educational technology looks like when it is aligned with the science of learning. Chris argues that schools have largely used computers to reinforce an outdated model of education based on lectures, passive learning, memorization, and standardized testing. Instead, he advocates for active learning, inquiry, collaboration, simulations, project-based learning, and authentic assessment. The conversation explores: Why schools resist change Immersive simulations and game-like learning Inquiry-based science education The limits of standardized testing Lifelong learning and the "60-year curriculum" Generative AI in education How teachers can use AI without undermining learning Chris Dede is Professor in Learning Technologies at Harvard University and one of the leading scholars in educational technology and the learning sciences. www.chrisdede.com Music by license from SoundStripe: "Uptown Lovers Instrumental" by AFTERNOONZ "Miss Missy" by AFTERNOONZ "What's the Big Deal" by Ryan Saranich Produced and hosted by Keith Sawyer. Copyright © 2026 Keith Sawyer
April 27 · 1 min
The Science of Learning - Trailer
What does science reveal about how people actually learn? Learning is one of the most important things human beings do—but it's also widely misunderstood. Popular culture is filled with myths, trends, and folk wisdom about teaching and learning, much of it unsupported by research. In The Science of Learning, Dr. Keith Sawyer talks with leading researchers about memory, attention, creativity, collaboration, technology, teaching, and human development. The podcast explores what evidence-based research reveals about how people learn, and how learning environments can be designed more effectively. This show is for anyone who wants to learn—and anyone who wants to help others learn: teachers, students, parents, designers, developers, leaders, and lifelong learners. The Science of Learning is produced and hosted by Keith Sawyer, Morgan Distinguished Professor of Educational Innovations at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and editor of The Cambridge Handbook of the Learning Sciences. You can also watch this show on YouTube. Subscribe for new episodes of The Science of Learning. For more information Keith Sawyer's web site: www.keithsawyer.com Copyright © 2026 Keith Sawyer

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