THE RUNNING EFFECT PODCAST

Dominic Schlueter

The Running Effect tells the best stories in running—and turns them into insight, inspiration, and tools to help competitive runners become greater.
Every week, host Dominic Schlueter sits down with the fastest, smartest, and most inspiring people in the sport—from Olympic medalists to breakthrough athletes—to unpack the stories, lessons, and mindset behind elite performance. Whether you’re chasing a personal best or looking to understand how greatness is built, The Running Effect will make you a deeper fan of the sport—and a better runner.

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743 episodes
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Yesterday · 1 hr 6 min
Eric Avila on How to Actually Get Recruited to Run in College: Why Almost Any Runner Can Earn a Scholarship, How NIL Deals Really Work, and What Coaches Are Looking For
Eric Avila quit racing, but he didn’t quit the sport altogether. The 2021 USATF Road Mile champion spent eight years with Adidas before walking away in 2024. This included a torn plantar fascia, a contract offer attached to a marathon move he didn't want, and a competitive fire that quietly fizzled out. What surprised him wasn't missing the racing. It was losing the structure that had organized every morning of his adult life. Now he runs a sports group out of Southern California, and he's direct with Dominic about how the money actually works. They talk about why you have to be roughly top ten in your event before anyone pays you, why high school NIL deals are a separate marketing bubble most athletes are built to age out of, and why the scholarship (not the shoe deal) is the realistic prize for nearly every kid. He also guesses at Josh Kerr's world-record bonus and weighs whether the sport will ever shed its contract NDAs. The back half is a coaching clinic. Avila builds training backwards from racing, argues most high schoolers show up with exactly one pitch, and caps his senior boys near 45–50 miles a week while loading the quality inside it. He walks through the traffic-light plan he gives athletes mid-race, what he taught a young Hobbs Kessler about leaning into pain, and why he'd rather an athlete learn to win than learn to time trial. Underneath all of it is one idea borrowed from European soccer: a real academy pipeline, built here, for runners. Tap into the Eric Avila Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 Instagram: @avilaericc
Friday · 53 min
How Fast Do You Really Lose Fitness? Alex Osberg on the Science of Detraining, Strategic Rest, and Coming Back Faster After Time Off
-The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs Fitness is rented, never owned. But the rent is far cheaper than most runners think. Alex Ostberg returns for the monthly breakdown of The Rundown, and this month's four editions split neatly into two halves: what actually happens when you stop training, and how to think clearly about training in the first place. Alex opens with the principle of reversibility and the psychology that distorts it—losses loom roughly twice as large as equivalent gains, which is why a two-week break triggers panic wildly out of proportion to the physiology. He walks through the Dallas Bedrest Study, then the Coyle detraining data showing a two-phase drop: an early fall driven almost entirely by plasma volume contraction, followed by a slower mitochondrial enzyme decline. The reassuring part is what survives: capillaries, ventricular volume, and mitochondria themselves are structural and stubborn. You don't fall from the top floor to the basement —you fall to the mezzanine. Then the case for doing it on purpose. Alex mandates enforced breaks for his athletes, argues that reduced training cuts losses roughly in half versus doing nothing, and shares Jerry Schumacher's balloon metaphor for why regaining fitness is easier the second time. The back half turns to coaching itself: confirmation bias; autobiographical coaching, the observe-hypothesize-measure-update loop; and why writing your hypothesis down before you test anything is the whole ballgame. Alex closes with the mistakes he's made, including his own biased-reporter problem with athlete pain. Read The Rundown: free, every Thursday. Link in the show notes. Tap into the Rundown Recap Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20
Wednesday · 1 hr 9 min
How Ryan Cole Made Air Force an NCAA Powerhouse: An Inside Look at the Service Academy Few Runners Ever See, the Culture Behind It, and Why the NCAA Has Nothing Like It
There are no names on the back of an Air Force jersey, and that's exactly the point. While the rest of college running chases NIL money, transfer portals, and eighth-year seniors, Ryan Cole is quietly building a national contender out of American kids who signed up for something bigger than themselves. In today's conversation, Dominic sits down with the Director of Track & Field and Cross Country at the U.S. Air Force Academy, where every one of 4,000 cadets is on full scholarship, the campus sits at 7,000 feet, and your first day of college involves getting yelled at off a bus at basic training. Coach Cole explains his core philosophy and how the Academy's structure turns overlooked recruits into stars—like Ryan Johnson, who arrived with a 9:20 two-mile PR and left drawing comparisons to Grant Fisher and Sam Gilman, the latter of whom he now shares workouts with. The two dig into the recruiting cues that separate a great athlete from a great cadet-athlete, the historic 2016 women's team that became the first service academy squad to qualify for a D1 NCAA Championship, and the emotional story of taking over the program after the sudden passing of his mentor, the legendary Ralph Lindeman. Plus, the beloved alumni tradition at Nuttycombe, why runners make great officers, and Cole's case that the service academies may be the last true development programs left in the NCAA. This one's about culture, commitment, and the name on the front. Tap into the Coach Ryan Cole Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20
July 27 · 52 min
UNC's New Women's Distance Coach: Ann Dunn on How She Landed the Job, What It Takes to Make It to D1, and Trying to Win an NCAA Title
Note from Dominic: for the first time in 800 episodes, had a weird issue where Ann's recording didn't save the last 5ish minutes of the podcast. So if it ends semi-abruptly that's why. Thank you for your understanding (: Enjoy! Ann Dunn wasn't looking for one of the biggest jobs in collegiate distance running. Then she came home from a run to a text from Chris Miltenberg, and two months later, she's the new head coach of UNC women's cross country. Dominic sits down with Ann just two weeks after Carolina made it official, and she shares the full behind-the-scenes story: the phone call with Milt, why he decided to split the men's and women's distance coaching so each group gets a dedicated touch point, and what made her say yes. Ann explains how a decade away from the NCAA (earning a master's in exercise physiology, building Formula Complete Fitness from the ground up in Charlottesville, and coaching The Covenant School to state titles) turned out to be an advantage, not a gap on the résumé. She opens up about holding humility and confidence at the same time, the conversation with her husband Jason that made the move possible, and the FaceTime call from Maddie and Reese (her former Covenant stars, now Tar Heels) after Milt dropped the news. Ann also revisits her own Wisconsin story, where her team climbed from last in the Big Ten to fourth at NCAAs in two years; lays out her goals for Carolina (top 5–10 nationally, competing for ACC titles); offers advice for high schoolers making the jump to college running; and pushes back on Dominic's claim that American teams can't win NCAA titles in the international-talent era. New chapter, new coach, same standard: Carolina blue with big goals. Tap into the Ann Dunn Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 Instagram: @coachanndunn Website: https://www.formulacompletefitness.com/
July 24 · 1 hr 2 min
The Mental Performance Coach Behind NAU's Championships: Shannon Thompson on How Runners Train the Mind to Race Without Fear, Break Through Plateaus, and Become Their Best
You can register for the program directly through the official Shannon Thompson MPC Focus Session Series Page Instagram: @shannonleighthompson Your ego isn't the enemy — it's just a bodyguard using outdated tactics. Shannon Thompson, MAPP, NCCP, is back for another edition of one of the podcast's longest-running traditions. The mental performance coach behind NAU's championship program (and the second-ever guest in show history) returns to break down the 16-page thesis she recently delivered at a coaching clinic, condensed into one conversation packed with tools you can use this cross-country season. Shannon unpacks what it means to "connect with the heart of the race,” and the three requirements to get there: a sense of belonging, a sense of irreplaceability, and an orientation toward giving rather than getting. From there, the conversation goes deep on the two stories every athlete lives through sport: the egoic story (work hard, achieve goals, repeat with higher goals) and the hero's journey—the narrative that begins when hard work stops guaranteeing results and you enter what Shannon calls "the wilderness." Along the way, they discuss why ego is never bad, just unhelpful; how parts theory (IFS) gets to the root of race-day anxiety, checking out mid-race, and mysterious pre-race nausea; the fear underneath it all;; a Scottie Scheffler-inspired debate on caring about outcomes without being owned by them; and a five-minute exercise you can use before your next race. Tap into the Shannon Thompson Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20
July 22 · 49 min
How Trevor Giampa Runs Sub-2:30 Marathons While Benching 315: Inside the Brutal Training Schedule of the Hardest-Working Hybrid Athlete Alive
Trevor Giampa doesn't call himself the best hybrid athlete — he says there's no such competition. He just refuses to accept the idea that chasing a goal in the gym has to cost him a goal on the course. In this episode of The Running Effect Podcast, Dominic sits down with Trevor to unpack six years of all-out hybrid training and the results that have people convinced he must be cheating: a 2:28 Boston Marathon and a 315-pound bench in the same week, treadmill marathons followed by 15+ reps at 225, and 100-mile weeks paired with powerlifter-style strength work. Trevor makes the case that "hybrid athlete = mediocre at both" is a myth, that antagonistic goals aren't really antagonistic if you build for them, and that your genetics improve the harder and longer you work. He's done it all as a natural athlete who has never had a sip of coffee, a drink of alcohol, or a single PED — and he explains why the constant doping accusations only fuel his mission to show people what a natural body is capable of. They also get into his diet (max protein, max carbs, ground beef and rice, venison, kiwis for vitamin C), his recovery philosophy (build a bigger capacity, skip the gadgets), his gym split, the caffeine debate, his move into ultras, and how his Catholic faith became the center of his content and his goals. 00:00 — Welcome & the late-night recording sacrifice 00:36 — How Trevor defines a "hybrid athlete" 01:05 — Real hybrid athlete vs. chasing social media clout 02:11 — Nick Bear, the BPN community, and breaking the "mediocre at both" stereotype 04:28 — His most impressive feat: 2:28 Boston Marathon + 315 bench in the same week 05:13 — What's harder, running or lifting? Genetics and training load 07:44 — Same-day treadmill feats (45-mile run → bench; 2:26 treadmill marathon → bench) 08:18 — Why you lose reps benching right after a run (blood flow) 08:56 — Height, weight, and race weight (5'9", ~185 lbs) 09:44 — Why shorter is better for running ("short kings") 10:10 — Handling constant doping allegations as a natural athlete 11:01 — Peptides, caffeine, creatine, and the "natty or not" spectrum 13:32 — Why PEDs make no sense if you value the work 14:42 — The supplement stack: creatine, magnesium, and kiwis for vitamin C 15:50 — Diet philosophy: max protein, max carbs, eat around your training 18:00 — Daily calories and protein (~3,500 cal / ~200g) 18:51 — Meal prep, Costco, and almost never eating out 19:12 — Hypothetical: would he promote caffeine for a BPN sponsorship? 21:00 — The caffeine debate and the "alpha flies" analogy 22:55 — Caffeine timing, G1M Sport, and the downside of race-day coffee 23:30 — Bicarb and legal performance aids 24:07 — Which BPN athlete would he race — and at what distance? 24:40 — The gym split: stacking leg day on your hardest run days 26:30 — Push/pull/legs, weekly frequency, and injury-prevention work 27:10 — Shout-out to Dr. Bill Evans 28:02 — Parents, his brother, and whether the genetics are really "crazy" 29:21 — "Your genetics get better the harder you work" 30:53 — Goal announcement: 2:25 marathon + 225×25 bench, same day, before 25 31:37 — Recovery: build a bigger capacity, not a bigger gadget collection 33:36 — Progressive overload vs. just maintaining muscle 34:47 — Does he recommend this lifestyle? Why hybrid is the future of fitness 36:23 — Dream sponsorships and faith-aligned brands (Barbell Apparel, Mark Dowdle) 39:46 — Trevor's faith journey and weaving it into his content 41:37 — Sacrificing training time for faith — and being blessed in return 42:27 — Killing the excuses: a full-time job and 84-hour work weeks 43:25 — How he trained around 12-hour refinery shifts in the dark 45:20 — The David Goggins comparison and his (slightly) saner schedule now 47:41 — The messages that keep him posting 48:16 — His "what if": deciding to start posting content 50:31 — Closing thoughts
July 20 · 45 min
A Coffee Table. A Dog Crate. The Top of the Empire State Building. Jacob Cohen on Quitting Investment Banking to Become the Internet's 5K Guy
Jacob Cohen has run a 5K in a dog crate, a port-a-potty, and on top of the Empire State Building–-and no, he is not stopping anytime soon. Before he was the internet's favorite 5K guy, Cohen was an investment banker in Atlanta, overweight and grinding through a banking job while his content dream sat on the back burner. Running, however, changed everything. It helped him lose more than 40 pounds, and a run club of full-time creators convinced him to hit record. He posted for a year to 2,000 followers before a joke 5K around his coffee table in October 2025 lit the fuse: it led to 100,000 followers in 50 days and a full-blown escalation of the most absurd run locations imaginable. In this conversation with Dominic, Cohen pulls back the curtain on the videos everyone's friends keep sending them. He addresses the skeptics head-on (yes, he really does the 5Ks; the watch accuracy is another story), reveals his most physically miserable run location, and explains why the World Cup crowd was in on the bit. He also opens up about the deeper mission: rejecting the unattainable, chicken-and-rice version of fitness the internet sold him at his lowest, and proving working out can actually be fun. Plus, his surprisingly generous take on David Goggins, celebrity collabs with Diplo, Bert Kreischer, Teddy Swims, and Casey Neistat, his dream Great Wall of China 5K, and why the biggest what-if of his life was simply pressing record. Tap into the Jacob Cohen Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 TikTok: @notreallywellness Instagram: @notreallywellness YouTube: @notreallywellness
July 18 · 46 min
From One Spot Off the Olympic Team to 12:49 5k and a Pre Classic Title: Parker Wolfe on Consistency, Beating Grant Fisher, and His Rookie Pro Year For The Ages
Parker Wolfe was the 43rd man on a 42-man Olympic list. Now, he's making the case for rookie of the year in professional running. Dominic sits down with the Swoosh TC Flagstaff star to unpack a debut season that reads like a highlight reel: a USATF cross country title on a muddy Portland course, top American honors at World XC in Tallahassee, a first sub-13 indoor 5K, a 12:49.45 Diamond League debut in Oslo, and a front-running Prefontaine Classic two-mile win over Grant Fisher. Parker opens up about going from top dog at UNC to "the new kid on the block" as a pro, why the professional peak is the hardest one to climb, and how he nearly committed to Duke before Chapel Hill won him over. He breaks down the transition from Chris Miltenberg to Mike Smith—more mileage, double thresholds, and a Flagstaff training group so deep he never lacks a partner, from Ethan Strand and Nico Young to the occasional Galen Rupp appearance. He makes his case that full buy-in beats a perfect program, walks through the Mo Farah-inspired tactics behind his gutsy front-running win at Hayward, and lands on the lesson at the heart of it all: people overestimate what they can do in a season and underestimate what they can do in a couple years of consistency. Plus, decoding Nike's confusingly structured Swoosh TC, Parker's five-runner Netflix docuseries cast, Nuggets loyalty, and the Lil Wayne deposition tape Coach Smith screened before Cross Nationals. Tap into the Parker Wolfe Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): ⁠https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs⁠ -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan:⁠ https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20⁠ Instagram:⁠ @parkerw19⁠
July 16 · 1 hr 11 min
How He Races Pro Trails on 25 Miles a Week: Meika Beaudoin-Rousseau on Sub-Ultra Racing, Creative Cross-Training, Creative Cross-Training, and the Freedom of Running
Meikael Beaudoin-Rousseau was fishing alone at the top of Nevada Falls at the age of 10, and has been finding ways to move faster through the mountains ever since. The Stanford-trained distance runner turned professional trail and mountain specialist joins Dominic to talk about a two-year injury saga that has redefined how he thinks about training, resilience, and what it actually means to compete. After a catastrophic fall at the 2024 Broken Arrow Skyrace left him with a complex orthopedic injury, Meikael spent 18 months trying every non-surgical approach available before going under the knife at the end of 2025. In February, he was relearning to walk. In April, relearning to run. He came back and toed the line at the 2026 U.S. Uphill Championships and finished 7th overall. The conversation covers what it looks like to maintain professional-level fitness off of 20 to 30 miles a week (and two hours of daily elliptical and arm bike work); why vertical kilometer races are physiologically closer to an 800 meter than a 10k; and how growing up entirely outdoors in the Bay Area (fishing, climbing, running trails to make curfew) built the athletic foundation that track never could. Meikael also gets into the plant business he started in middle school, the summers he spent living out of his car in the Sierra Nevada, and why he thinks cross-country skiers would beat marathoners in a trail race every time. His message to anyone trail-curious: DM him. He means it. Tap into the Meikael Beaudoin-Rousseau Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop Instagram: @mountain_man_meik
July 14 · 34 min
Inside the Penn State 800m System: Handal Roban on the 1:42 Breakthrough, Why He Stopped Chasing Times, and the Mantra Behind Every Race
He bet his uncle he could beat him in a race, and that was the start of everything. Handal Roban grew up in Saint Vincent and the Grenadines playing cricket before a single track meet at age fifteen changed his trajectory. When the cricket team pushed him out, he didn't look back. Instead, he chased the guys who beat him—literally moving to Jamaica to train at Jamaica College High School, one of the most decorated prep programs in the Caribbean. That decision, he says, taught him how to navigate being the underdog, how to thrive in discomfort, and how to carry the weight of a new culture in silence when no one could understand a word he said. At Penn State, Roban has quietly built one of the most decorated careers in school history: two Big Ten Freshman of the Year awards; multiple All-American honors; a trip to the Paris Olympics at 21 years of age; and a 1:42.87 at the 2025 NACAC Championships that left him thinking the clock was broken. That time made him the second-fastest 800m runner in NCAA history. He still can't fully believe it. But what defines Roban isn't the resume, it's the philosophy underneath it. Stop chasing times. Find your mantra. Get comfortable being uncomfortable. Don't respect your competitors so much that you forget to race them. And when the butterflies show up before the gun, don't fight them, channel them. With one year of eligibility remaining and an NCAA title still on his list, Roban isn't close to done. Tap into the Handal Roban Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 Instagram: @handal.roban X (Twitter): @imhandalroban TikTok: @handal.rob
July 12 · 1 hr 18 min
How Will Garinger Built a Run Club Spanning 85 Cities and 7 Nations: The Loneliness Epidemic, Identity, and Getting Outside Yourself
Will Garinger can't explain how Run with Christ became so popular—and that might be the point. Less than two years after a group of 20-year-olds gathered in a Columbus park in September 2024, Run with Christ spans more than 85 cities across seven nations and three continents. Its founder never ran competitively. Garinger was a goalkeeper—an All-American who left for a Phoenix soccer academy at 16, jumped into life insurance sales at 18, and landed a Division I roster spot at UNC Greensboro. Every rung up the ladder looked right and felt empty. Behind the résumé was a kid cycling through addiction, shame, and Sunday-morning resets, hiding from everyone—including his own father. The turning point came one week after the run club launched. On September 14, 2024, a stranger prayed over Garinger, asked about his relationship with his dad, and named things nobody could have known. Garinger fell apart, confessed twenty years of hiding, and walked out a different man. In this conversation, Garinger and Dominic dig into why the most connected generation in history is the loneliest, why discipline and human connection are the only currencies you can't fake in the AI era, and why your worth never changes based on what you produce. Garinger shares the question he asks everyone searching for purpose: What makes you angry when you look at the world? Whatever you believe, this one is about getting outside yourself. Tap into the Will Garinger Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 Instagram: @willgaringer_ TikTok: @williamgaringer
July 10 · 40 min
From 3:57 in High School to a 3:48 Pro Debut: Gary Martin on the NCAA's Brutal Depth, Signing with Brooks, and Chasing Josh Kerr in Seattle
Nobody hands you anything in the Bowerman Mile—not even on your first day. Two days after his professional debut at the Prefontaine Classic, Gary Martin joined the show to break down a lifetime-best 3:48.76 in the deepest mile field ever assembled, and why he walked away wishing he'd been more aggressive. The newest Brooks Beast member takes us inside the shock of going out in 1:53 after a college season of tactical racing, lining up against Ethan Strand again, and what it felt like to finally pull the Brooks singlet out of the bag after two years as one of the brand's first NIL athletes. Gary is refreshingly honest about the season behind him: falling short of the NCAA 1500 title against Simeon Birnbaum, the frustration of watching a new contender rise every time he reached the top, and the mindset that carried him through it. He explains what drew him to Danny Mackey and Seattle, why Josh Kerr's discipline in the margins inspires him, and lays out the ladder for his pro career—make teams, make finals, then fight for medals. Plus, they get into the PA sub-4 pipeline he started, Vin Lananna's pencil-sharpening analogy, the habits that kept him healthy for four straight years, his advice for every high schooler dreaming of going pro (be patient, be present), and a dream 4x-mile squad featuring Kerr, Cam Myers, and Jakob Ingebrigtsen—with Gary leading off, naturally. This is a chat with one of the sport's brightest young stars, at the very beginning of the climb. Tap into the Gary Martin Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop $20 off your next Attuned scan: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 Instagram: (@gary.martin20).
July 8 · 45 min
She Almost Hung Up the Spikes. Then Everything Changed. Notre Dame Hurdler Reese Sanders on Comeback, Confidence, and Running for No One but Herself
Reese Sanders ran a 57.3 and realized she wasn't done. Coming off her final season at Notre Dame, Sanders—a four-time Indiana state champion and one of the top 400m hurdlers in Fighting Irish history—was closer to walking away from the sport than sticking with it long term. What changed wasn't a grand plan. It was momentum: a fast race at ACCs, another personal best at regionals, and a quiet afternoon running unattached at a meet in Duke where it finally felt like she was running for herself. That shift changed everything. In this episode, Reese walks Dominic through the last 30 to 90 days that rerouted her entire post-college trajectory. From near-retirement, to staying in South Bend as an assistant coach under Coach Rodney Zurich—all while training toward the 2028 U.S. Olympic Trials. She talks about what it actually took to believe she could keep getting better: journaling with God before races, learning to check out from track in order to get better at it, and finally letting go of the pressure she put on herself the moment she stepped on campus as a recruit. The conversation covers her athletic family roots, growing up watching siblings Olivia and Luke run state, building a social media following of 62,000 from her dorm room, co-hosting the Golden Ticket Podcast, and what it felt like to get recognized by a Nebraska thrower at a random track meet. She's self-aware, wide open, and genuinely funny—and she's just getting started. The road to 2028 has commenced. Follow along. Tap into the Reese Sanders Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@Dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZL Luminary Threads: luminarythreads.shop Instagram: @reese.e.sanders TikTok: @reese.e.sanders X: @reese_saa
July 6 · 1 hr 24 min
26 Years. Two Dynasties. No Participation Medals. Doug Soles on Buy-In, the 2009 Loss That Still Haunts Him, and Why He Walked Away at the Peak
Doug Soles just walked away from the most dominant program in the country, and he's not done building. The two-time NXN champion coach joins Dominic to reflect on 26 years of head coaching and his recent decision to step down at Herriman High School. Soles opens up about the toll of 12-hour days, his choice to leave teaching first, and why he's leaving his next move "wide open" rather than rushing into another job. He traces his evolution from a rookie coach in the desert heat of Palm Springs with just three athletes to building two national powerhouses, crediting the shift from copying others to developing his own philosophy as the real turning point. Much of the conversation centers on buy-in: how Soles convinces five-flat milers they're capable of greatness, why travel to big meets reframes how kids see the sport, and how he handles excuses, transfers, and kids who are "half in, half out." He's candid about losses that still haunt him, the 2009 state title he let slip away, and the lessons that shaped everything after. Soles also discusses coaching Jackson Spencer through an undefeated season and why he believes in earning success rather than handing out participation trophies. He closes with reflections on handling critics, the importance of fit over title, and passing the Herriman program to his successor, Josh Bugel, on his own terms. A thoughtful, occasionally funny, and deeply earned conversation with one of the most accomplished coaches in American distance running history. Tap into the Coach Doug Soles Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop Official Website: CoachSoles.com X: @DougSoles Instagram: @dougsoles
July 4 · 56 min
From a Year Without Leaving His House to a Guinness World Record: Mike Egan on Adversity, Repurposing Suffering, and Dragging His Chair Through the Mud at the BPN G1M Ultra
He gave everything for his country, came home without his legs, and then completed 110 miles anyway. Mike Egan is a Marine combat veteran who lost both legs to an IED in Afghanistan. In this conversation, he sits down with Dominic to talk about the G1M Go One More Backyard Ultra in Texas, where he completed 27 loops (110-plus miles in a wheelchair over 27 straight hours) finishing 27th in a field of able-bodied athletes. When heavy rain turned loop 27's course into thick mud and locked his wheels, Egan climbed out of the chair and crawled, dragging it behind him. He barely blinked. But the race is almost a footnote. What Mike actually delivers in this hour is a masterclass in how to think about suffering. He talks about the year he didn't leave his house, the slow crawl back out of isolation, and the realization that endurance sport wasn't about fitness—it was the first thing that forced him to face what he'd been packing down for years. He talks about repurposing pain, the discipline of not breaking promises with yourself, and why he never asks "what if," he just does. He also pushes back hard on one thing: don't compare your hardships to his. Your suffering is your own. How you respond to it is all that matters. This is one of the most direct, no-fluff conversations about identity and resilience TRE has ever produced. Tap into the Mike Egan Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop Instagram: @mike_egan88 TikTok: @mike_egan88
July 3 · 25 min
Reflecting on a Record-Breaking Freshman Year: Jane Hedengren on What Year One at BYU Taught Her, Summer Base Training, and Chasing a Cross Country Title
Jane Hedengren doesn't do freshman years quietly. Coming off a breakout debut season at BYU, the Nike-sponsored phenom joins Dominic ahead of the Prefontaine Classic to reflect on a year that redefined her expectations of herself. Hedengren opens up about the whirlwind of transitioning from decorated high schooler to collegiate standout, describing her freshman year as less about the records and wins and more about the growth, the team bonds, and the hard-earned lessons that came with it. She talks through her simplified shoe rotation, what it's really like working alongside Nike's product teams, and how the "less is more" training philosophy from her Nike Elite days still affect how she approaches her buildup. She also opens up about periodizing a season that won't peak until November, the value of resting and reconnecting with family this summer, and how she's staying grounded as her siblings chase their own running success. The conversation turns reflective as Jane considers her long-term legacy in the sport, weighing the pull between cross country's singular, winner-take-all drama and the technical precision of track. Asked to choose between breaking four minutes in the mile or fourteen minutes in the 5K as the sport's next historic barrier, she doesn't hesitate to share her pick, while acknowledging both feel closer than ever. Through it all, Jane's answers land with a maturity beyond her years, a steady reminder that she's chasing greatness one present moment at a time. Tap into the Jane Hedengren Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop Instagram: @janehedengren
July 1 · 1 hr 4 min
12 Weeks. One Shot. Everyone Else Is Resting. The Mike Scannell Special That Will Set You Apart: Grant Fisher's Coach on the Summer That Separates the Fast From the Forgotten
Mike Scannell doesn't believe in mileage—he believes in how you run it. Back on the show for another appearance, the architect of Grant Fisher's Olympic campaign sits down with Dominic to talk about something every serious runner faces and most get wrong: the summer training block. Scannell makes the case that the six weeks in the dead heat of summer are the truest measure of who an athlete is going to become. When the training gets long, boring, and hot, most kids quit. The ones who don't are the ones worth coaching. The conversation moves from training philosophy into the psychology of competition. Scannell breaks down how he handles disappointment with athletes and why he refuses to let any kid internalize a bad race as a reflection of who they are. He talks about goal-setting with the same directness: limit them to three or four; share them only with people qualified to help you reach them; and let your daily actions do the announcing. He also goes after the mileage obsession head-on. Most kids are addicted to a number on Strava instead of the quality of the miles that produced it. Scannell has seen it at every level, and his prescription is simple: rest, hydration, and mild but honest training—in that order. The summer doesn't need to be heroic. It needs to be consistent. Sharp, direct, and full of the practical coaching wisdom that's made him one of the most respected voices in American distance running. Tap into the Coach Mike Scannell Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop
June 29 · 1 hr 35 min
pov: you are a fly on a wall for a convo between 4 running friends like they're on a long run
The boys are back, and nobody came to talk about running. Dominic welcomes Scotty, Danny, and Chris from the Life in Stride podcast for their fourth appearance on TRE, and within minutes the conversation has already covered protein powder side effects, dry needling in uncomfortable places, and Dom's near-date with one of the most famous athletes on the planet. Before things go completely off the rails, Dom shares the story behind his role as a strategic advisor for Attuned—a bioenergetics company whose health scanning technology helped his sister recover from over a decade of chronic illness. From there the group runs through their list of overhyped running products, with Dom going on record as a full Ketone IQ skeptic, and the guys trading takes on cold plunges, Normatec boots, and Firefly devices. The rapid-fire segment produces some of the episode's best moments, including a spontaneous revelation about his DM history with Olympic snowboarder and cultural phenomenon Eileen Gu, in addition to a detailed accounting of what Dom would actually cook for you if you showed up hungry at his door tonight. The episode closes with a lively argument about whether Dom's brother's daily mileage challenge is more impressive than running a 2:34 marathon, the crew announcing plans for a live podcast marathon, and all four sharing genuine closing words about making the most of your days before the summer slips away. Tap into the Life in Stride Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S Attuned 20% off: https://attuned.health/discount/TRE20?ref=TRE20 -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ LuminaryThreads: luminarythreads.shop Instagram: @lifeinstridepodcast YouTube: Life In Stride
June 27 · 59 min
Coach Chris Miltenberg on the Crisis Inside College Running: The Foreign-Talent Surge Reshaping Recruiting, the Age Gap No One Will Touch, and Whether the NCAA Can Still Develop American Stars
The NCAA isn't broken: it's been bought, and Coach Chris Miltenberg is one of the last ones willing to say so out loud. Miltenberg returns to the show fresh off an NCAA Championships in Eugene where the women's 5,000 and men's 10,000 runners were swept nearly clean by international athletes funneled in through university-funded recruiting services. He called it what it is: a paradigm shift, driven by two forces—an age gap that routinely pits 18-year-old Americans against 26- and 27-year-olds, and a recruiting model that has traded relationship-building for transactional delivery. What separates Coach Milt from the noise is that he's not talking about this from the outside—UNC was largely absent from the results in Eugene, too, and he said so plainly. But he's not wringing his hands either. He's choosing to double down: develop elite American talent the long way, backed by institutional alignment and a recruiting pipeline that he and his assistant have quietly rebuilt around the next wave of domestic standouts. He also addressed what this moment means for the American high schooler with D1 dreams —the 4:10 miler, who, five years ago would have been a priority recruit and today might not crack a Power Five roster. His advice was blunt: go where you matter. Find the coach who's invested in your development, not your opening time. Coach Milt also touched on Michaela Page's continued rise, the Penn relay rivalry, Simeon Birnbaum's 1500 in Eugene, and what it feels like every June to watch another senior class walk out the door. Tap into the Coach Milt Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ luminarythreads.shop Instagram: @chris.miltenberg
June 25 · 36 min
From a Down Year to 1:57 — 2nd-Fastest in NCAA History: Hayley Kitching on the Comeback, Confidence, and the "I'm Her" Mentality
Running a 1:57 doesn't happen by accident. And for Hayley Kitching, it almost didn't happen at all. A year ago, the Penn State senior was in Austin nursing plantar fasciitis while watching the sport move without her. Hayley is here to unpack the full arc: the injury, the comeback, and the NCAA Outdoor final at Hayward Field where she ran the second-fastest 800 meters in collegiate history—and still finished second. Hayley and Dominic go deep on what actually drove the jump from 2:20 in high school to 1:57 on the biggest stage. Her answer isn't a secret workout or a revolutionary training block. It's consistency—a Monday steady run and showing up even when the motivation isn't there. She also opens up about the nutritional wake-up call that changed her freshman year, her three-day-a-week lifting program that includes a leg circuit she calls "leg day on crack," and the afternoon nap that she considers non-negotiable. The conversation gets equally honest about the mental side: the confidence she's carried since her junior days in Coffs Harbour; how she thinks about the difference between confidence and pride; and why she'd tell her younger self to get off Instagram and stop comparing results. She also reflects on the NCAA Indoor fall in March, what it felt like to sprint the fastest final lap of the day and still not make the final, and why she came out of Eugene happy despite leaving without the win. Hayley is heading pro. This episode is the perfect send-off. Tap into the Hayley Kitching Special. If you enjoy the podcast, please consider following us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and giving us a five-star review! I would also appreciate it if you share it with your friend who you think will benefit from it. S H O W N O T E S -The Run Down By The Running Effect (our new newsletter!): https://tinyurl.com/mr36s9rs -Our Website: https://therunningeffect.run -THE PODCAST ON YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClLcLIDAqmJBTHeyWJx_wFQ -My Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/therunningeffect/?hl=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -Take our podcast survey: https://tinyurl.com/3ua62ffz Behind the scenes of The Running Effect: https://youtube.com/@dominicschlueter?si=PM9FjPc92eFUFEZ luminarythreads.shop