GovernmentSociety & CultureDocumentary

The Law, such as it is

Lawrence Lessig

An exploration of a broken, if beautiful, institution, the law, and tradition, America. Season one told the story of a case, LESSIG v. NYT. Season two begins the story about a country, America, and values that country has betrayed.

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20 episodes
Avg 1 hr 3 min
English

Episodes 20

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S3 · E10
May 22 · 44 min
Bonus episode: NotebookLM's summary of the case (Corrected)
In this episode, we share a podcast create by NotebookLM based on the transcripts from the 9 episodes of the podcast. It is a powerful summary of the case, which is a great introduction to the issues presented across the episodes.
S3 · E9
May 6 · 1 hr 52 min
The Closing Argument
In this final episode, Lessig pulls together the argument from across the season. Why did this happen? What should happen next?
S3 · E8
April 17 · 47 min
Unpacking the final allegation — "Allegation 1"
Allegation 1 is the only allegation within the 6 year limit for fraud investigation. In this episode, we show why it too fails — and the astonishing failure in the investigation that could have shown precisely what had happened.
S3 · E7
April 15 · 48 min
Unpacking "Allegation 3"
In this episode, we review Allegation 3, and reveal the simple omission that undermined the investigation into this allegation.
S3 · E6
January 30 · 58 min
Dismantling "Allegation 4"
We continue in this episode by unpacking the charges behind allegation number 4, which involved a paper written 15 years ago.
S3 · E5
Dec 1, 2025 · 8 min
Allegation 2, continued
Clarifying one additional point about Allegation 2 in less than ten minutes.
S3 · E4
Nov 17, 2025 · 59 min
Dismantling "Allegation 2"
So far, this podcast has considered the procedural flaws that marred the process that led to Francesca Gino's tenure being revoked. With this episode, we begin dismantling the substantive conclusions as they relate to the four alleged cases of fraud. We begin with "Allegation 2."
S3 · E3
Sep 18, 2025 · 1 hr 17 min
How you know when a process has too many lawyers
In this second of two episodes interviewing Francesca, we cover the period from HBS' determination that she had committed academic misconduct through the University's decision to revoke her tenure.
S3 · E2
Aug 21, 2025 · 1 hr 53 min
How You Know a Business School is Not a Law School
In this first of two episodes interviewing Francesca, we cover a bit about the nature of her work, and then the period beginning from the charges being raised against her through the business school's determination that she had committed academic misconduct.
S3 · E1
Aug 21, 2025 · 24 min
Introduction
Francesca Gino was a superstar at the Harvard Business School. This year, she was fired for academic misconduct. In this season, we'll explore that story through interviews with Francesca and others. This episode introduces the story and the plan of the season.
S2 · E8
Nov 9, 2021 · 1 hr 16 min
Episode 8 - System Error
Lessig talks to Rob Reich, Jeremy M. Weinstein and Mehran Sahami about their new book, SYSTEM ERROR — which unpacks the effect of technology on culture and policy, and redirects how we might respond.
S2 · E7
Sep 30, 2021 · 1 hr 22 min
Episode 7 - David Vine
American University Professor David Vine has developed a powerful critique of the war mentality that America takes for granted. We argue about whether we should be a "welfare state." Why don't we argue about whether we should remain a "warfare state." In this episode, he discusses two of his books, The United States of War and Base Nation, and what lessons they teach us now.
S2 · E6
Sep 23, 2021 · 1 hr 1 min
Episode 6 - Daniel Immerwahr
A discussion with Daniel Immerwahr about his book, How to Hide An Empire. The United States is not comprised solely of states. As well as states, our nation includes territories. This book tells the story of the role and place of those territories in the history of the United States. #Empire America
S2 · E5
Sep 16, 2021 · 1 hr 16 min
Episode 5 - Zephyr Teachout
A discussion with Zephyr Teachout about her book, Break 'Em Up. Zephyr is the most important thinker on the Democratic left. This conversation continues from the last about how markets have been transformed from engines of freedom to systems of control. #Competition
S2 · E4
Sep 9, 2021 · 1 hr 10 min
Episode 4 - Barry Lynn
A discussion with Barry Lynn about his new book, Liberty from All Masters. There is a kind of competitive market that the American story presumes — competitive, every actor having limited power over us. This book tells the story of the undoing of that market. #Competition
S2 · E3
Sep 2, 2021 · 1 hr 24 min
Episode 3 - Stephen Kinzer
A discussion with Stephen Kinzer about his book, Overthrow. Overthrow tells the story of the many times the United States has intervened directly and militarily to change the course of government in other nations. #Empire America
S2 · E2
Aug 26, 2021 · 1 hr 47 min
Episode 2 - Edward Snowden
A discussion with Edward Snowden about his new book, Permanent Record. In 2013, Snowden revealed to the world the extent of the US government's mass surveillance program. This book tells the story of Snowden's life and the decision to sacrifice as he did to let us know this truth. #Privacy
S2 · E1
Aug 19, 2021 · 1 hr 6 min
Episode 1 - Andrew Bacevich
A discussion with Andrew Bacevich about his new book, After the Apocolypse. Bacevich is America's most thoughtful conservative skeptic about the scope of America's military empire, and the urgent need to redirect our focus. #Empire America
Aug 12, 2021 · 10 min
Season 2 Intro
This is an introduction of this season and ideas that the season will explore. Anti-empire, privacy, and competition: these ideas, or as I will call them, values, represent the best of who we've been; they are also values we've betrayed. These conversations are part of the research for a possible new book. Explore the ideas with me, and with your feedback, help me think them through.
S1 · E4
Jul 1, 2020 · 32 min
EP 4 - Case Closed
In a surprising twist, the New York Times changed its headline and lede. In this episode, Lessig explains the decision to withdraw the case.

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