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The Ethically Immoral Podcast

Hosted by: Mike Payne

The Ethically Immoral Podcast is a program dedicated to long-form conversations with poets, spoken word artists, authors, and creatives who use language as a tool for truth-telling, healing, and resistance. Hosted by Mike Payne, the show travels beyond the typical interview to explore the personal histories, artistic philosophies, and cultural contexts that shape the voice of the Creatives we welcome.

It’s not just about poetry or performance — it’s about the people behind the pen. We talk about identity, healing, joy, frustration, and the journey of becoming. Some moments are deep, others are funny, but all of them are authentic. If you’re someone who values storytelling, vulnerability, and good conversation, this space was created and cultivated for you.

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22 episodes
Avg 1 hr 57 min
English

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August 17 · 2 hr 24 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Fourteen - Our Conversation with Shelly Conley
In Volume Seven: Chapter Fourteen of the Program, we welcome Milwaukee, Wisconsin-born and based Poet, Author, Community Activist, and the 14th Poet Laureate for the City of Milwaukee, Shelly Conley. A seven-time member of Milwaukee’s National Poetry Slam Team, she serves as Program Director of My Sista’s KeepHer and is the author of Rewind: A Cathartic Autobiography. In our conversation, we travel through Shelly’s creative history, beginning with journaling at nine years old, her early love of hip-hop, and eventually discovering poetry in middle school. We revisit the year she spent attending Dasha Kelly’s open mic at the old Mecca Nightclub before finally finding the courage to step on stage herself, and how that experience changed her relationship with poetry and taught her the power of sharing our words with others. We discuss how Shelly has carried that lesson into her work today, from creating a space for emerging writers through The Writers Hive Poetry Open Mic to helping young women explore their emotions, experiences, and voices through My Sista’s KeepHer. Shelly also opens up about her once-complicated relationship with her mother, the role writing played in their healing, and their decision to tell that story together through their book project, Writing It Together. Finally, we discuss the journey that led Shelly to becoming Milwaukee’s 14th Poet Laureate, the surprise of learning she had been selected, and an incredible full-circle moment: years after finding the courage to share her poetry at an open mic created by Dasha Kelly, Shelly would eventually succeed her as Poet Laureate. From a nine-year-old writing privately in a journal to helping others discover the power of their own words, Shelly’s story is one of finding your voice, having the courage to share it, and eventually creating space for others to find theirs. Contact Shelly: Instagram: @poeticworkinprogress Website: shellyconley.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Aleah Bradshaw – Questions Instagram: @nyfe Lyrical Faith – Bilingual Instagram: @lyricalfaithpoetry Jahman Hill– Cash Me Outside Instagram: @jahman_rondo Website: jahmanhill.com Shelly Conley – 2am Free Write Instagram: @poeticworkinprogress Website: shellyconley.com Natasha Ria El-Scari – The Secret Society of Black Mothers Instagram: @natasharia Website: natasharia.com Support the show
August 10 · 1 hr 46 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Thirteen - Our Conversation with Maya Marshall
In Volume Seven: Chapter Thirteen, we welcome Poet, Writer, Editor, Educator, and Author Maya Marshall. She is the Poetry Director and an editor at Haymarket Books, co-founder of underbelly, a journal dedicated to the art and practice of poetic revision, and a MacDowell and Cave Canem fellow. She is the author of All the Blood Involved in Love, winner of the 2025 Holmes National Poetry Prize. In our conversation, we trace Maya’s creative journey back to a childhood where art, literature, politics, and public service were woven into her everyday life. She reflects on growing up around Austin, Texas's Black Arts Alliance, traveling throughout the state as her mother performed a one-woman play, writing her own “little poems” while waiting in the wings, and giving her first public poetry reading at an anti-Klan rally in Austin when she was seven years old. We explore the experiences that transformed an early instinct for writing into an intentional study of the craft—from Writers in the Schools and afternoons spent reading poetry in bookstores to her lifelong fascination with books, music, galleries, museums, and language itself. Maya discusses the difference between loving poetry and learning how to write a good poem, why she doesnt romanticize inspiration, and the importance of practice, revision, and eventually learning when to trust a poem enough to let it go. Our conversation also examines poetry as the constant Maya continued returning to while trying to imagine a practical life as a writer, and her belief that poetry may be the closest thing to faith she has. We discuss the balance between solitude and community throughout her life, reflecting on a remarkable personal practice she began at sixteen—writing herself a letter every birthday documenting what she is proud of and grateful for—and what those letters have revealed about confidence, ambition, and a deepening acceptance of self. From the little girl surrounded by artists and books to the poet whose own work now sits on shelves alongside writers she once admired, this is a conversation about learning not simply how to write poetry, but how to build a life around it—and what it means to eventually help create that space for others. Contact Maya: Instagram: @maya.marshall.16 Website: mayamarshallpoetry.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Ayanna Albertson – What That Mouth Do Instagram: @untouchableyann Shanelle Gabriel – Daddy's Girl Instagram: @shanellegabriel Website: shanellegabriel.com Christopher Diaz – Again Instagram: @lightbulbchris Website: christopherdiazcreates.com Leah V – 3am Instagram: @leahvspeaks Website: leahvspeaks.com Ebony Stewart – Single Instagram: @gullyprincess Website: ebpoetry.com Support the show
July 27 · 2 hr 11 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Twelve - Our Conversation with Grace
In Volume Seven: Chapter Twelve of the podcast, we welcome Hong Kong-born, Midland, Ontario-based poet and author Grace. Holding a double BA in English Literature and Psychology from the University of British Columbia, Grace is the author of The Language We Were Never Taught to Speak and her newest collection, Be Water, available now from Anvil Press. Our conversation traces Grace's creative journey from an avid childhood reader who eagerly returned home from weekly library trips with stacks of novels, to someone who initially found poetry uninspiring and imposed upon her in high school. She reflects on how discovering contemporary poetry, becoming immersed in Vancouver's vibrant literary community, and finding an early champion in the partner who became her first editor transformed poetry from an academic exercise into a deeply personal means of understanding herself and the world around her. Grace opens up about growing up in a family where emotions were rarely spoken aloud, explaining how poetry became the language through which she could process memories, identity, family history, queerness, culture, and belonging. We explore the surprising evolution of her debut collection, The Language We Were Never Taught to Speak, discussing how individual poems gradually revealed themselves to be part of a larger conversation, how publishing that first book validated her identity as a poet, and how writing it helped release her long-held fixation on the past. We also discuss finding confidence as a performer within Vancouver's spoken word scene, learning to embrace joy and playfulness in the writing process, and the evolution that led to her newest collection, Be Water. Grace shares how the new book feels less like a return to old wounds and more like a continuation of healing, exploring relationships, identity, and self-understanding from a place of greater compassion and emotional clarity. It's an honest and thoughtful conversation about creativity, healing, identity, and discovering that sometimes the language we're searching for is the one we learn to write ourselves. Contact Grace: Instagram: @thrillandgrace Website: grace-writes.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Joel Francois – Liars Instagram: @thedapperdaydreamer Fanta Ballo – Broken Hearts Instagram: @fantaratty Crystal Valentine – Little Known Fact Instagram: @crystalvalentine94 Website: iamcrystalvalentine.com The Legendary Black Ice – Who Would I Be Instagram: @thelegendaryblackice The Legendary Black Ice – Bigger Than Me Instagram: @thelegendaryblackice Support the show
July 19 · 1 hr 59 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Eleven - Our Conversation with Molly Peacock
In Volume Seven: Chapter Eleven we welcomed Buffalo, New York-born, Toronto-based Poet, Essayist, Educator, Biographer, and Author Molly Peacock. She earned her BA from Harpur College at Binghamton University and her MA from Johns Hopkins University. She has served as president of the Poetry Society of America, founded The Best Canadian Poetry series after moving to Canada, and her literary papers are housed at the Binghamton University Library. Molly is the author of numerous poetry collections, works of prose, and the memoir Paradise, Piece by Piece. Her latest collection is The Widow's Crayon Box. In our conversation, we explore the creative foundation shaped by a family where books and writing were woven into everyday life. Molly reflects on her mother's voracious reading habits, her grandmother's lifelong practice of writing alongside the routines of daily life, and the teachers and mentors who encouraged her to think of herself as a writer long before she fully believed it herself. We also trace her evolution as both an artist and a person, discussing what it meant to become the first in her family to attend college, the confidence she discovered during her years at Johns Hopkins, and how formal poetry became less about following rules than finding a structure capable of holding life's most powerful emotions. Finally, we explore The Widow's Crayon Box, a collection born from the loss of her husband that reveals the many colors of widowhood rather than the single shade society often imagines. Molly reflects on the first twenty-eight days following his passing, the moment she realized she was beginning what she calls "the turn" into widowhood, and how the poems emerged naturally as a way to process grief, preserve love, and transform profound loss into art. Contact Molly: Instagram: @mollypeacockpoet Website: mollypeacock.org Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Arantza Garcia – Recipe Book Instagram: @arantza.cgf Ghetto Jedi The Poet – I Am Metaphor Ayanna Florence – Boy Calls Me Pretty Instagram: @poetnextdoor Blog: poetnextdoor.medium.com Rundy Francisco – My Honesty Poem Instagram: @rudyfrancisco Website: iamrudyfransicso.com Alyesha Wise – Flowers Instagram: @alyeshawise Website: alyeshawise.com Support the show
July 13 · 1 hr 53 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Ten - Our Conversation with Isabelle Correa
In Volume Seven: Chapter Ten of the Program, we welcome Poet, Educator, and Author Isabelle Correa for an in-depth and thoughtful conversation about identity, faith, family, healing, and the long, often complicated journey toward becoming a writer. Born in Moses Lake, Washington, Isabelle reflects on growing up in a household with twelve siblings, navigating feelings of loneliness despite never being alone, and being raised in a religious home where certain paths in life seemed predetermined. She shares how an early engagement, an unexpected change in direction, and a willingness to imagine a different future ultimately led her toward writing. Our conversation explores her beginnings in creative nonfiction and her eventual discovery that poetry offered something narrative could not. We also discuss reclaiming spirituality outside organized religion, writing through trauma without forcing resolution, and allowing flawed, vulnerable voices to exist honestly on the page. Along the way, Isabelle talks about the importance of writing communities, and how workshops, mentorship, and organizations like Gather Poets helped shape her development as a writer. We also discuss her forthcoming collection, Portrait of a Person Who Pushes Love Away in Fear of Losing It and Other Poems, and the winding path that brought her from Washington State to Mexico City. Contact Isabelle: Instagram @isabellecorreawrites Website: isabellecorrea.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: A Glowing Poet – Love, Eventually Instagram: @aglowingpoet Website: thewomaniambecoming.com Daniel Garwood – Hangman Instagram: @doowrag.daniel Website: danielleegarwood.com Shay The Poet – The First Time I Hated Myself Instagram: @shay.thepoet Matt Capone – Some Love Shit Instagram: @matt__capone Yex– Man Vs. Bear Instagram: @yass_yex Support the show
June 29 · 2 hr 9 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Nine - Our Conversation with Blair Trewartha
In Volume Seven: Chapter Nine of the Podcast, we welcomed Clinton, Ontario-born and London, Ontario-based Educator, Writer, Author, and Poet Blair Trewartha. The author of three chapbooks and two full-length poetry collections, including the recently released Half-Earth, Blair joins me for his first appearance on the program to discuss a collection more than a decade in the making. We begin by celebrating the release of Half-Earth, reflecting on the excitement surrounding its launch, the warm reception it has received, and what it means to finally share a new full-length collection twelve years after his Relit Award-shortlisted debut, Easy Fix. From there, Blair discusses how becoming a father fundamentally reshaped both his life and his writing, explaining how conversations with his two sons unexpectedly became some of the emotional foundations of the new book. Together, we explore how parenthood transformed his understanding of skepticism, compassion, mortality, and the uncertain future his children will inherit in a world shaped by climate anxiety and rapid technological change. Our conversation then turns back to Blair's creative beginnings. Growing up on a farm outside Clinton, Ontario, he reflects on the rural landscape that continues to influence his imagination and the lasting impact of the nearby Goderich salt mine. He discusses how the stories shared by family members and friends who worked in the mine left a deep impression, leading us into a discussion about the importance of listening, oral storytelling, and the fascination with other people's stories, which evolved into a desire to tell his own through poetry. Contact Blair: Instagram @btrewart Purchase Half-Earth: Here Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Meccamorphosis – Penny Dreadfuls Instagram: @meccamorphosis Website: meccamorphosis.com Leah V – Yours Instagram: @leahvspeaks Website: leahvspeaks.com Mike Rosen – When God Happens Instagram: @heymikerosen Sonya Renee Taylor – My Body Is Not An Apology Instagram: @sonyareneetaylor Steven Willis – The Hustle Speaks Instagram: @stevenwillispoetry Website: stevenwillispoetry.com Support the show
June 22 · 2 hr 14 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Eight - Our Conversation with Dasha Kelly
In Volume Seven: Chapter Eight of the Program, we welcome Milwaukee, Wisconsin-born and based Writer, Poet, Storyteller, Author, Performance Poet, Teaching Artist, and Creative Change Agent Dasha Kelly. A former Milwaukee Poet Laureate and Wisconsin's first Black Poet Laureate, Dasha has spent decades building community through the power of story, imagination, and creative expression. During our conversation, Dasha reflects on her early years as a self-described curious kid, arts-and-crafts enthusiast, and natural storyteller. We discuss the role her mother played in encouraging her creative pursuits, her early interest in fiction writing, and how a fascination with psychology and human behavior ultimately intersected with her lifelong love of storytelling. Dasha shares her journey into poetry, including her initial resistance to the form before eventually embracing it as a powerful vehicle for exploration and connection. We talk about her creative process, how she determines whether an idea belongs in poetry, fiction, or nonfiction, and the ways those forms often overlap in her work. We also examine the evolution of Milwaukee's literary community through Dasha's eyes, comparing her reflections from the early 2000s to the thriving creative culture she helped cultivate over the years. She speaks candidly about community building, connection, and the profound impact of bringing together people from different backgrounds through shared artistic experiences. Contact Dasha: Website: dashakelly.com Instagram: @dasha_kelly Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Porsha O. – Trigger Instagram: @porshaolayiwola Website: porshaolayiwola.com Barbara Fant – Medicine Instagram: @iambarbarafant Website: barbarafant.com Black Chakra –I Spit Fire Instagram: @blackchakra88 Ariana Brown – Supremacy Instagram: @arianathepoet Website: arianabrown.com Javon Johnson – Shotgun Instagram: @javonism Support the show
June 1 · 2 hr 6 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Seven - Our Conversation with Jennifer LoveGrove
In Volume Seven: Chapter Seven of the podcast, we welcome Dunnville, Ontario-born and Toronto-based Writer, Author, and Poet Jennifer LoveGrove. Jennifer is the author of four full-length poetry collections and the novel Watch How We Walk, which was long-listed for the Giller Prize. Her poetry collection Beautiful Children with Pet Foxes was long-listed for the Raymond Souster Award, and her newest collection, The Tinder Sonnets, is available now via Bookhug Press. In our conversation, we discuss Jennifer's creative history—from childhood creativity and growing up with a typewriter and lamp-chair writing setup, to the lasting influence of religion and the sense of outsiderhood that shaped both her worldview and artistic voice. We discuss her movement between fiction and poetry, whether those creative instincts originate from the same creative space, and the realities of maintaining a writing practice beyond romantic ideas of inspiration. Jennifer speaks candidly about discipline, resistance, self-doubt, and the emotional terrain of writing—why first drafts can feel exhausting, what revision gives back, and whether satisfaction comes from the act of writing itself or from seeing something new brought into existence. We also spend time discussing The Tinder Sonnets—a collection based on Jennifer’s experiences navigating dating apps and modern relationships in middle age. Our conversation touches on vulnerability, confession, female desire, misogyny in contemporary dating culture, and the expectations society places on women as they age. Jennifer reflects on writing openly about intimacy and emotional complexity, what it means to transform personal experience into poetry, and whether the collection brought clarity, confrontation, or simply another way of living alongside difficult truths Contact Jennifer: Purchase The Tinder Sonnets: bookhugpress.ca Instagram: @jenlg52 Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Prentice Powell – True Love Instagram: @prenticepowell1906 Website: prenticepowell.com Asia Samson – Enough Instagram: @theasiaproject Website: theasiaproject.com Alysia Harris – Death Poem Instagram: @poppyinthewheat Website: alysiaharris.com Kyla Janee Lacey – I Pulled Out A Knife On Him Instagram: @kylajlacey Website: thatswritekyla.com Emi Mahmoud – Window Games Instagram: @emibatuta Website: emi-mahmoud.com Support the show
May 25 · 2 hr 8 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Six - Our Conversation With Steven Seidenberg
In Volume Seven: Chapter Six of The Program, we welcomed Boston-based Photographer, Poet, Writer, Philosopher, and Visual Artist, Steven Seidenberg. We discuss Steven’s newest poetry collection, Coda, his ongoing photographic work, including his exhibition at the John and Geraldine Lilley Museum of Art and the forthcoming photographic project Kanazawa Vacancy. In our conversation, Steven reflects on what it means to see his work displayed publicly and discusses his fascination with photographing empty landscapes, abandoned structures, and unstable environments—images that ask viewers not simply to look, but to reconsider what they’ve been seeing all along. We discuss Steven’s early creative and intellectual history. He talks about his youthful attraction to poetry and philosophy, describing a compulsive literary obsession that shaped his identity and ultimately led him to leave high school before finding his academic footing at Simon’s Rock and later Bard College. We discuss the influence of reading on writing, the role philosophical literature played in his development, and how his interest in photography emerged alongside his early writing life, including memories of developing black-and-white photographs in his uncle’s darkroom. Our conversation also explores family influences, Steven’s path through philosophy and academia, and his eventual transition away from teaching and copy editing toward a full-time creative life. Along the way, we unpack his remarkably patient artistic process, with projects often taking a decade or more to complete. This was a thoughtful and reflective conversation about observation, artistic patience, intellectual curiosity, and the lifelong pursuit of meaning through multiple creative forms. Contact Steven: Website: stevenseidenberg.com Instagram: @steven.seidenberg Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Brittany Barker – The Classroom Before the Revolution Instagram: @iambrittanybarker Joshua Bennett – 16 Bars For Kendrick Lamar Instagram: @sirjoshuabennett Website: drjoshuabennett.com Gina Loring – Freedom To Learn Instagram: @ginastarlight Website: ginaloring.com Steven Willis – Instead Of A Suicide Note, I Wrote This Instagram: @stevenwillispoetry Website: stevenwillispoetry.com Alexis Green – He Used To Send Me Flowers Instagram: @poetalexisgreen Website: poetalexsisgreen.com Support the show
May 11 · 2 hr 12 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Five - Our Conversation with Brenda Cardanes
In Volume Seven: Chapter Five, Brenda Cárdenas joins the Program for a wide-ranging conversation about creativity, language, culture, visual art, and the experiences that shaped her voice as a writer and poet. A Milwaukee, Wisconsin born and based educator, essayist, and author, Brenda earned her undergraduate degree from the University of Wisconsin–Milwaukee, her teaching certification from the University of Wisconsin Oshkosh, and her MFA in Creative Writing from the University of Michigan. She is the author of the award-winning poetry collection Trace, which received the 2024 Society of Midland Authors Poetry Award and was the Silver Award winner of the 2023 Foreword INDIES Poetry Awards. She is also the author of three chapbooks, served as Milwaukee Poet Laureate from 2010–2012, and in 2025 was named Wisconsin Poet Laureate. Throughout the conversation, Brenda reflects on growing up surrounded by creativity in many forms—from family members who painted, crafted furniture, made saddles, and told stories—to discovering poetry as the medium that allowed her to fully explore culture, memory, and identity. We discuss her early love of visual art, arts and crafts with her aunt, and the impact storytelling had on her imagination as a child. Brenda also talks about beginning to write stories around the age of eight, being encouraged by teachers early on, and eventually discovering poetry in high school through an American Authors course. Our conversation explores the importance of representation in literature and how discovering Latin poetry and bilingual writing during undergrad changed her understanding of what poetry could do. Brenda speaks candidly about how encountering poets who reflected her own culture and experiences gave her permission to more openly write about identity, language, and heritage. The conversation also touches on what it is like sharing life with fellow poet and former Milwaukee Poet Laureate Roberto Harrison, the ways visual art continues to influence her writing process, and what it meant to receive the call informing her that she had been selected as Wisconsin’s Poet Laureate in 2025. Contact Brenda: Website: brendacardenas.net Instagram: @brenda.cardenas.754 Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Ephraim Nehemiah – Inheritance of a Broken Home Instagram: @ephariamnehemiah Khalil Saadiq – Somebody's Watching Me Instagram: @khalil_saadiq Alexandria Bennett – Color Blind Instagram: @caffeinatedliving Denice Frohman – Accents Instagram: @denicefrohman Website: denicefrohman.com Lionheart – Pretty Hurts Instagram: @lionheartfelt Website: lionheartfeltonline.com Support the show
May 3 · 1 hr 50 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Four - Our Conversation with Leah V
In Volume Seven: Chapter Three of the program, we welcome Bronx-born, New York City-based Writer, Performance Poet, Curator, and star of the one-woman show "The Long Way Home", Leah V. In our conversation, we trace her creative history—from writing poetry at seven, to studying musical theater, to finding her footing in New York’s spoken word scene. We touch on her recent marriage and what it’s like balancing something deeply personal with a public life rooted in performance. We revisit "Virtual Voices", the virtual open mic space that introduced me to her work back in 2020, and her "partner in Creative crime" and co-host JRose. We spend time on a pivotal chapter—losing her father, the silence that followed, and what brought her back to writing during COVID. That return to the page becomes a turning point, not just creatively, but personally. At the center of the conversation is her one-woman show, The Long Way Home: A Spoken Word Journey—a piece built around her late father’s poems and journal entries. We talk about what it means to carry someone’s voice forward, what she discovered about him in the process, and how grief evolves when you’re forced to sit with it, shape it, and share it. We also get into the New York poetry community, the importance of creative spaces, her experience performing at the Apollo Theater, and how she thinks about the stage—as a place of discovery or revelation. Contact Leah V: Website: leahvspeaks.com Instagram: @leahvspeaks Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Just Ace – What If I Was Him Instagram: @iam_justace Arantza Garcia – Recipe Book Instagram: @arantza.cgf Kennie Sings – Like A Lady Instagram: @kennie_sings Leah V – 3am Leah V - Yours Instagram: @leahvspeaks Website: leahvspeaks.com Support the show
April 26 · 1 hr 49 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Three - Our Conversation with Irina Moga
In Volume Seven: Chapter Three of the program, we welcomed Writer, Author, and Poet Irina Moga. Her work has been nominated for the SFPA Rhysling Award and Best of the Net, and her collection Variations Without Palace was the 2022 winner of the Dina Sahyouni International Literary Prize. She’s the author of six collections, including her latest, Quantum, and is an active member of several literary organizations across Canada. In our conversation, Irina discusses her early creative beginnings—starting with a poetry group in high school that, in her words, “mercilessly” tore apart each other’s work. What could have discouraged a young writer instead became foundational, shaping her approach to revision, experimentation, and resilience. We talk about what it means to have your work challenged early, and how that kind of environment can either push you out—or pull you deeper in. We also spend time on one of the more fascinating parts of her journey: the transition from writing in Romanian to writing in English after immigrating to Canada. Rather than simply carrying over her voice, Irina made the intentional decision to rebuild it. We get into what that process looked like in real time—the frustrations, the disconnects, and what it took to stay committed to that evolution instead of retreating to what was familiar. Throughout the conversation, Irina shares how writing lives for her today—not just as a craft, but as a space. A space of silence, concentration, and layering, where language, culture, and personal experience intersect. We talk about poetry as both deconstruction and reconstruction—how it allows us to break reality apart and reassemble it into something that feels more true, more honest, and sometimes more bearable. Contact Irina: Website: irinamoga.com Instagram: @pictopoems Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Taalam Acey – Affirmation for Black Men Instagram: @taalamacey Website: taalamacey.com Brandon Alexander Williams – Black Woman Studies Instagram: @brandonalexanderwilliams Anita D. – Colors Instagram: @anitadpoetry Alyesha Wise – Cannibal Instagram: @alyeshawise Website: alyeshawise.com Ciara Chantelle – Empty Cups Instagram: @ciarachantelle Support the show
March 31 · 2 hr 12 min
Volume Seven: Chapter Two - Our Conversation with Stephanie Bolster
In Volume Seven: Chapter Two of the podcast, we welcomed Vancouver-born, Quebec-based Educator, Writer, Poet, and Author of the poetry collection Long Exposure, Stephanie Bolster. Stephanie is Professor of Creative Writing at Concordia University, earned her BFA and MFA from the University of British Columbia, and is the author of five poetry collections. In our conversation we discuss her creative beginnings—starting with early storytelling, a childhood desire to become an author, and the writers who helped define her path. She speaks on discovering poetry through Emily Dickinson, and later finding something deeper and more urgent in the work of Sylvia Plath—an influence that helped shift poetry from something she enjoyed to something she needed. We also spend time unpacking identity—what it meant to call herself a poet early on, before expectations and career entered the picture, and how that relationship to the word “poet” has evolved over time. That idea opens into a broader conversation about imagination, the role poetry plays in making sense of the world, and whether those two instincts—creation and understanding—work together or pull in different directions. We discuss Long Exposure, a project more than a decade in the making, and what it means to finally bring that work into the world. Stephanie reflects on her relationship with the collection, the time it took to come together, and how living with a manuscript for that long shapes both the work and the writer behind it. We close on process and balance: her writing routine, the importance of physical space and environment, and the ongoing challenge of making room for writing within the realities of teaching, family, and life. It’s a transparent look at the tension between knowing writing is essential and still having to negotiate time for it. Contact Stephanie: Website: stephaniebolster.com Instagram: @stephaniebolster0110 Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Shanelle Gabriel – Vanity Instagram: @shanellegabriel Website: shanellegabriel.com Matt Capone – Learned with Love Instagram: @matt__capone Gigi Bella – Slut Instagram: @ggbellag Website: gigibellapoetry.com Anyrah Shaveh – We Must Not Die Young Instagram: @iamshaveh Website: anyrahshaveh.com Moody Black – Eight Letters Instagram: @iammoodyblack Website: iammoodyblack.com Support the show
March 23 · 1 hr 34 min
Volume Seven - Chapter One - Our Conversation with Ebony Stewart
In Volume Seven: Chapter One of the Program, we welcome Houston, Texas–born and based Educator, Playwright, Actress, Writer, Author, and Performance Poet Ebony Stewart. She is the 2017 Woman of the World Slam Champion, a three-time Austin Neo Soul Slam Champion, a B. Iden Payne Award recipient, and the David Mark Cohen New Play Award winner. She is also the author of four books, including her latest poetry collection Wash, which was recently named an Honors Award winner by the Texas Institute of Letters. In our conversation, Ebony reflects on what that recognition for Wash actually means—not just as an acknowledgment of the work itself, but as an outside validation of her writing acumen. We talk about the evolution of her voice, the version of herself that shows up in this collection, and how periods of creative difficulty—graduate school where writing poetry became difficult—shaped the way she approaches the page now. We also spend time sitting with something a lot of artists tend to move past too quickly: accomplishment. With a résumé as extensive as hers, Ebony discusses how often she truly pauses to take it in. Ebony opens up about the leap into becoming a full-time creative—what it looked like before that transition, the grind of balancing teaching with constant travel and performance, and the moment she decided to bet on herself. From there, we get into confidence: what it’s made of, how authenticity, self-awareness, and emotional honesty factor into it, and how she’s learned to carry heavy things like grief without letting them define every room she walks into. Contact Ebony: Website: ebpoetry.com Instagram: @gullyprincess Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Nayo Jones – We Will Not Ask Instagram: @nayojones Website: nayojones.com Jay Ward – Gentrification Instagram: @jayward2030 Alysia Harris – Controlled Burn Instagram: @poppyinthewheat Website: alysiaharris.com Ebony Stewart: How We Forget (After Loyce Gayo) Ebony Stewart: Single Support the show
March 16 · 1 hr 53 min
Volume Six: Chapter Twenty - Our Conversation with Kathryn MacDonald
In Volume Six: Chapter Twenty of the Program, we welcome Ontario-based Educator, Writer, Painter, Photographer, Author, and Poet Kathryn MacDonald. Our conversation explores the many ways creativity can intersect—through poetry, visual art, travel, and teaching—and how each discipline shapes the way an artist observes and responds to the world. Kathryn discusses her reputation as an ekphrastic writer, explaining how her poetry often emerges from an emotional dialogue with visual art and the details she encounters in everyday life. We talk about the role observation plays in her work, her writing process, and how reading and creative community continue to shape her development as a writer. We also explore her experiences as a sailor and traveler, how those journeys have influenced her imagination, and the relationship between her poetry, painting, and photography. The conversation concludes with a discussion of her forthcoming poetry collection, The Blue Gate, a lyrical exploration of love, grief, and the shifting emotional landscapes that follow loss. Contact Kathryn: Website: kathrynmacdonald.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Jae Nichelle – Brown Skin Girl Instagram: @croptopassassin Website: jaenichelle.com Emi Mahmoud – Window Games Instagram: @emibattuta Website: emi-mahmoud.com Crystal Valentine – I am Black before Woman in February Instagram: @crystalvalentine94 Website: iamcrystalvalentine.com Natasha Ria: Shine Website: natasharia.com Instagram: @natasharia Javon Johnson: Building Instagram: @javonism Support the show
March 8 · 1 hr 37 min
Volume Six: Chapter Nineteen - Our Conversation with Maria Giesbrecht
In Volume Six: Chapter Nineteen of the Program, we welcome Durango, Mexico-born, Toronto-based Poet, Author, Curator, and Writer Maria Giesbrecht. She is a graduate of the post-graduate Creative Writing program at Humber College and the winner of the Jack McCarthy Book Prize and the Lesley Strutt Poetry Prize. Her work has also been recognized as a finalist for the Narrative Poetry Prize, a Best of Net nominee, and the runner-up for the Eden Mills Poetry Contest. She is the author of the poetry collection Peeling Oranges, and her forthcoming collection A Little Feral is scheduled for release May 8 and is currently available for pre-order. In our conversation, Maria and I talk about how her love of language began early—reading a Nancy Drew book nightly as a kid—and how poetry first entered her life in eighth grade through a science teacher who introduced her to spoken word and rap. We explore how writing became both refuge and release during difficult years growing up, and how persona poems help her navigate creative blocks. Maria also reflects on her religious upbringing and the complicated relationship she has had with faith, doubt, obedience, and questioning—and how writing has helped her process that evolving spiritual conversation. We discuss the early-morning creative state she relies on for drafting poems, and the turning point when she left a career in corporate accounting to pursue writing full-time. Finally, we talk about her writing community Gather, the role it plays in supporting other writers, and the ideas behind both of her poetry collections. Contact Maria: Instagram: @theguelphpoet Website: mariagiesbrecht.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Marie Foolchand – I am the People, the Mob Instagram: @laframbuessa Dua Saleh – Fractions Instagram: @doitlikedua Website: duasaleh.com Gabriel Ramiez – On Realizing Im Black Instagram: @poetramirez Website: ramirezpoet.com Andrea Gibson: Nutritionist Website: andreagibson.org Instagram: @andreagibson Dani Cook: Recess Instagram: @thedanicook Website: thisisdani.com Support the show
February 23 · 1 hr 47 min
Volume Six: Chapter Eighteen - Our Conversation with David Martin
In Volume Six: Chapter Eighteen we welcome Educator, Poet, Writer and Author David Martin. He earned his BA in English from the University of Calgary and his MA in English from the University of Alberta. His work has been widely recognized across Canada’s literary landscape — including winning the CBC Poetry Prize, receiving the Silver Award for Poetry from the Alberta Magazine Awards, and being shortlisted for the W.O. Mitchell Book Prize, the Banff Mountain Book Competition, and FreeFall Magazine’s poetry contest. He is the author of two chapbooks and four full-length poetry collections, including his recently released book Night Stead. In addition to his poetry, he is the frontman and primary songwriter for the multi-genre band The Fragments, whose eight-album catalog spans indie-pop, alternative, jazz-inspired textures, and most recently, country. In our conversation, we explore the intersection of music and poetry — whether songwriting and verse come from the same creative space, and how genre shifts function in his artistic evolution. We trace his creative history back to a pivotal, life-changing poetry reading by multidisciplinary artist Kirk Miles — a moment that reframed how he understood poetry and ultimately led to his involvement with Calgary’s long-running Single Onion Poetry Series, where he now serves as an organizer. We also talk about his obsession with sound, his process of recording and listening back to drafts, and how grief — particularly the loss of his brother — reshaped both his writing practice and the emotional architecture of his work. Finally, we dive into Night Stead — a formally inventive and deeply personal collection that challenges conventional reading structures while exploring vulnerability, memory, and interior life. This is a conversation about discipline and experimentation, silence and return, structure and sound — and what it means to build a creative life across multiple mediums. Contact David: Instagram: @david_jamesmartin Website: davidjamesmartyin.ca Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Alyssa Michelle – The Mis-Education of the Introvert Instagram: @poetress_michelle TikTok: @poetress_michelle Khalil Saadiq – Somebody's Watching Me Instagram: @khalil_saadiq Shawn William – Tired Instagram: @iamshawnwilliam Kelsey Bigelow: A Grandfathers Hands Instagram: @kelkaypoetry Website: kelkaypoetry.com Anna Maria Morris: A Love Poem for Myself Instagram: @annamariamorris Website: annamariamorris.com Support the show
February 2 · 1 hr 54 min
Volume Six: Chapter Seventeen - Our Conversation with Kestral Gaian
Our guest this week is a Scotland, United Kingdom–based writer, poet, playwright, and author. Kestral Gaian, who is the author of four books, including their most recent poetry collection, Tubelines: The Poetry of Motion, available now via their website and wherever books are sold. In our conversation, we trace Kestral’s parallel paths through creativity and technology — including a lengthy career in software and tech — and how those two worlds increasingly collide. That collision leads us into a thoughtful discussion of artificial intelligence, creative labor, and authorship, sparked by Kestral’s project justsayno.ai. We talk candidly about over-reliance on AI, creative disruption, and the growing concern that AI may help people produce writing without necessarily helping them become writers. From there, we move into Kestral’s creative history: starting to write at the age of five, transitioning from storytelling into poetry, and grappling early on with questions of identity and representation. Growing up under the shadow of the UK’s Section 28 — legislation that erased queer stories from schools and libraries — profoundly shaped what felt possible to write. We talk about silence, visibility, and the long-term effects of being told certain stories shouldn’t exist. The conversation then turns to Tubelines, a poetry collection written over five years and inspired by fifty encounters on the London Underground. We talk about people-watching, movement, routine, and the quiet humanity that reveals itself in shared spaces. Contact Kestral: Instagram: @kes.tr.al Website: kestr.al Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Toni Payne – Let the Headline Scream Instagram: @tonipaynequotes Website: tonipayneonline.com Meccamorphosis – Thrift Shop Instagram: @meccamorphosis Website: meccamorphosis.com Asia Samson – As I Am Instagram: @theasiaproject Website: theasiaproject.com Christopher Diaz: Again Instagram: @lightbulbchris Website: christopherdiazcreates.com Matthew Cuban: Shotgun Instagram: @matthewcuban Website: matthewcuban.com Support the show
January 19 · 2 hr 15 min
Volume Six: Chapter Sixteen - Our Conversation with Leslie Saint Julien
In Volume Six: Chapter Sixteen of The Program, we welcome Poet, Actor, Producer, Playwright, and Author of the new book Hair Me, Leslie Saint Julien. Making her third appearance on the podcast, Leslie returns to discuss the evolution of her personal and powerful stage project Hair Me: A Journey Through the Rich Tapestry of Black Hair and the book of the same name. In this wide-ranging and honest conversation, Leslie shares how 2025 became a transformative year after a period of burnout and creative exhaustion, and what she’s learned about rest, resilience, and intention. We explore her journey from writing an award-winning poem to developing it into a one-woman stage play, complete with a companion book, script, and educational study guide designed for classrooms. She opens up about the pressures Black women face when it comes to hair — not just in terms of aesthetics, but as a matter of survival, self-expression, and social perception. We dig into the emotional and cultural weight of “code-switching” one’s hairstyle, the complexity of navigating critique, and the behind-the-scenes work required to bring a theatrical vision to life. Leslie is also the author of Brooklyn Stew and three poetry collections. A graduate of the University of Maryland with a degree in Criminology and Criminal Justice, she later studied acting at the New York Film Academy. Contact Leslie: Instagram: @lesliesainjulien Website: lesliesaintjulien.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Destiny Birdsong – Killing White Instagram: @bird_songoftheyear Website: destintbirdsong.com Destiny Birdsong – Mythicona Instagram: @bird_songoftheyear Website: destinybirdsong.com Ray Jane – Spoils Instagram: @itsrayjane Website: itsrayjane.com Summer Durant: Same Instagram: @summeraen Ghetto Jedi the Poet: Strap Up Support the show
January 5 · 2 hr
Volume Six: Chapter Fifteen - Our Conversation with Barbara Fant
In Volume Six: Chapter Fifteen of The Program, we welcome Educator, Community Activist, Poet, Performance Poet, and Author Barbara Fant, who is making her third appearance on the podcast. Born in Youngstown, Ohio and now based in Los Angeles, Barbara is the author of three poetry collections Paint, Inside Out, Mouths of Garden, and her newest collection, Joy in the Belly of a Riot. For over a decade, she has led poetry workshops for incarcerated youth and adults, people in recovery, and survivors of human trafficking and domestic violence. In this conversation, we talk about the journey of releasing a new book, returning home for her Ohio book launch, and the creative relationships that have shaped her path — including long-standing friendships formed through performance poetry and slam. Barbara also shares what it means to be named a Recording Academy 2025 New Member, becoming a voting member for the Grammys, and how poetry, music, and performance continue to intersect in her life. We dive into her slam and performance history, finding joy on the other side of trauma, and how Joy in the Belly of a Riot helped her arrive at a clearer understanding of who she is — fully embracing faith, poetry, and purpose without compartmentalizing any part of herself. A thoughtful, honest, and wide-ranging conversation about art, healing, joy, and becoming. Contact Barbara: Instagram: @iambarbarafant Website: barbarafant.com Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include: Sunshine Lombre – Daydream Instagram: @ladylombre Tonya Ingram – Monster Instagram: @tonyainstagram Theresa Davis – Why I Do This Instagram: @shepiratepoet Website: artisttheresadavis.com Barbara Fant: Brown Bodies Bending Instagram: @iambarbarafant Website: barbarafant.com Barbara Fant: Medicine Instagram: @iambarbarafant Website: barbarafant.com Support the show

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