ArtsSociety & Culture

New Creative Era

Joshua Citarella and Yancey Strickler

A podcast exploring how creative people develop their practices and the worlds we live and operate in.

metalabel.substack.com

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20 episodes
Avg 41 min
English

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S2 · E15
June 30 · 29 min
How Artist Corporations became law
This week on New Creative Era, we explore the process of how Artist Corporations became law in Colorado. In the first-ever solo episode of NCE, Yancey walks through the detailed process of what it took to turn Artist Corporations into law, including lessons learned and news on what’s next. Read the companion essay at ystrickler.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
April 28 · 1 hr 4 min
Cake in a box
We are back. Not yet in our usual weekly cadence (that resumes after the summer), but back for an episode and an overdue catchup after the longest gap we've had in over a year. Josh, ever the jetsetter, talks about being part of the Whitney Biennial and Venice Biennale and a 4:30am call with the European Parliament. Yancey, ever the striver, talks about the latest on Artist Corporations and the path ahead, as well as all things DFOS. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E13
February 24 · 1 hr 1 min
Forward not back
In the finale of season 02 of New Creative Era, Josh and Yancey take stock of everything we've learned across 12 episodes exploring dark forests, private online communities, and the forces shaping culture online and beyond. We trace the genealogy of the web — from Web2's gatekeeping revolution to the attention economy to the subscription era's rebundling — and arrive at the present moment, where people are retreating into private spaces to build something new. We both share a list of what we hope for and fear from a dark forest era: sustainable creative ecosystems, the return of editorial vision, new organizational structures, and a more sincere internet — alongside the risks of digital country clubs, culture wars on steroids, rent-extracting platforms, and the same extractive patterns repeating themselves. It's not nostalgic. It's a path forward. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E12
February 17 · 53 min
Four countries or a thousand?
Back with part two of our special AMA episodes fielding questions from our NCE DFOS space. This episode covers everything from nationalism to Section 230 to open source software and everything in between. How far will the dark forest take us? Listen in as we debate and discuss IRL. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E11
February 11 · 1 hr 3 min
The two wolves
This week Josh and Yancey sit down in the same room for the first time to answer questions from 250+ people who found their way down the rabbit hole into the New Creative Era DFOS (link here 🤫) after last week’s audio easter egg. In week one there have been more than 900 chats and an organic book club already started. In this episode, we answer five questions from community members covering community governance, paywalled vs. free spaces, the real source of enshittification, and even how much it costs to run Metalabel. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E10
February 4 · 47 min
What if you could start your own internet?
This season of New Creative Era, we’ve been exploring the idea of dark forests. This week we’re exploring one in reality. Together. Listen in as Josh and Yancey give the first-ever tour of Dark Forest OS, a new Metalabel release that creates shared private internets. If you listen closely, you just might hear the breadcrumbs to a new world. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E9
January 27 · 50 min
The internet has been building to this
In this episode, Josh takes listeners through the concept of teleology: the idea that tools inevitably drift toward outcomes embedded in their design, regardless of intent. What does this say about platform technology, political organizing, and competing visions for the private internet? Drawing on Benjamin Bratton’s “The Stack,” the conversation examines how cloud platforms are assuming functions once reserved for nation-states, pointing toward what some call “network states.” But whose network state? There’s a sharp line between two visions: one built on social democracy with private cultural spaces flourishing on top, and another where gutted welfare states force people into resource-sharing enclaves surveilled by Palantir and organized through Urbit. Are we heading towards one or the other? Or both? This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E8
January 20 · 30 min
The politics of withdrawal
Are dark forests just retreat? Adam Curtis documented how 1970s communes and EST taught people to pursue happiness within themselves rather than pursuing a better society. Are dark forests the same trap? James C. Scott’s work on the “hidden transcript” offers a different frame. Private spaces aren’t just where people hide, they’re where shared understanding forms, where you say what can’t be said publicly. Is dark foresting irresponsible or the product of our times? Listen in as we explore. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E7
January 13 · 34 min
Ingroups and outgroups
Is curation actually about exclusion? In this episode, Josh and Yancey explore one of the most uncomfortable questions in creative communities: what it means to draw boundaries around who belongs and who doesn’t. Web2’s promise of open platforms and the death of gatekeeping hasn’t led to creative liberation — it’s produced attention economies driven by sensationalism and the collapse of shared values. What does a world where values are protected and explicitly shared look like? This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E6
Dec 17, 2025 · 31 min
Dark forests and antimemetics
A key fact of dark forests: they don’t want to be seen. Dark forests are spaces hidden from public view where outside eyes are not welcome. Why is this the case? And what can we observe about spaces like this? In this week’s episode of New Creative Era, we connect the idea of “antimemetics” — ideas that are intentionally hard to share and see — with dark forests. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E5
Dec 10, 2025 · 40 min
Do dark forests live forever?
This week on New Creative Era, Josh and Yancey explore the lifecycles of Dark Forest spaces. How do they start? How do they mature? How do they die? Do they die? Listen in to hear how our micro personal experiences and macro group dynamics collide. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E4
Dec 3, 2025 · 32 min
The philosophy of dark forests
This week on New Creative Era we dive deeper into the world of dark forests and the underlying philosophies and belief systems behind their existence. How should we feel about dark forests? Are they places of threat or respite? Are they spaces of retreat or infrastructure for dissent? Are they inherently revolutionary and counter-hegemonic or are they potential tools for oppression, too? Listen in as we touch on the many ideas and beliefs that shape dark forests and why we gather in them. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E3
Nov 26, 2025 · 43 min
The economics of the dark forest
This week in New Creative Era we dive into how exactly Dark Forest spaces support themselves, what it costs to run one, and all the implications of online-native proto-institutions that can create their own economics, currencies, and even tax systems. Why is this happening and where will it lead? After the usual s**t-talking, Josh and Yancey dig in. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E2
Nov 18, 2025 · 34 min
What's a Dark Forest?
This season on New Creative Era, we’re diving into the world of Dark Forests. But what exactly is a Dark Forest? What’s the origin of the term, and what does it describe? In this episode, Josh and Yancey walk through what a Dark Forest is and why they’re increasingly central to not just our digital lives, but society at large. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S2 · E1
Nov 14, 2025 · 33 min
The return
You thought it was over. But we’re so back. Welcome to a new season and focus for New Creative Era. This year we’re diving deep into the world of dark forests: private online spaces hidden from outside view. Why do Dark Forests exist? What goes on in them? What are their economics? What are their philosophies? We’ll be exploring all of this, and much more. But first, we have a lot to catch up on. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S1 · E13
Jun 24, 2025 · 51 min
Artist Corporations: new podcast and early traction
Last week our TED Talk introduced Artist Corporations (A-Corps) — a legal and economic structure for creative work. So far there have been: * 200k+ views of the TED video * 600+ artists and creators joining the waitlist Listen On a special episode of New Creative Era (embedded above), Josh Citarella grills me on the nuts and bolts: * How A-Corps would work * What doesn’t work about the status quo * What solo practitioners would gain on day one Play the episode above. Help us shape the law Your challenges and desires will help shape the law we take to legislators. Support this work by sharing more about your own practices here: Squads paving the way While we work towards manifesting Artist Corporations, it’s important to recognize the squads, groups, and artists out there doing the work right now. Just in our universe there is: * Concept — An ironic network state collective that released a sold out zine earlier this year. * Do Not Research — A collective Discord that drops work and publishes material together. * Elysian Collective — Writers pooling reach and profit around themed anthologies. * Future Commerce Press — A new media publishing empire releasing work across formats. * Hard Art — A collective of artists across disciplines led by Brian Eno. * Network Archives — Dozens of musicians come together to share their experiences releasing work online. * Other Internet — One of the most influential web-based collectives of the past decade. * Play — An award-winning food-themed, LGBTQ+ zine and collective. * Serving the People — A global creative network. * The Dark Forest Collective — Sixteen internet writers who collectively publish work and share profits together. * TIAT — An SF-based new media + tech collective. * Underground Art and Design — An art + tech collective in Brooklyn. * Wondaland — A creative collective led by Janelle Monae. * Worst Generation — A hip-hop and digital collective out of South Carolina. These are all collections of people releasing work under a shared umbrella, using splits and shared economics to distribute the rewards. This path is available to any creative person right now. Artist Corporations will let those groups go even farther together. Join the waitlist Want the A badge the moment filings open? Your early interest will help us make the case to lawmakers: Questions? What do you want to know? Thoughts? Questions? Leave a comment and let’s chat. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S1 · E12
May 13, 2025 · 30 min
Why talk about the creative life?
This week marks the final episode of the first season of New Creative Era, as well as the release of a new book that collects all our conversations into printed form: On the Creative Life: Conversations Towards a New Creative Era. In this episode, Josh and Yancey discuss why even have conversations like ours? What is this moment in our collective creative journey? Though this is the last episode of this season, we’re interested in continuing these conversations. Want more New Creative Era? Let us know by picking up a copy of the book, or by reaching out: hello@metalabel.com. Peace and love, y’all. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S1 · E11
Apr 28, 2025 · 37 min
Seven things we want out of a new creative era
In the penultimate episode of the first season of New Creative Era, Josh and Yancey each come to the table with their list of seven things they most want in a new status quo. These are our answers. What about yours? What do you want in a New Creative Era? This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
S1 · E10
Apr 21, 2025 · 33 min
What we wish we knew then
What lessons do we keep with us from our creative journeys so far? This week Josh and Yancey turn back the clock and take turns sharing seven things they know now but wish they knew then. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com
Apr 15, 2025 · 28 min
How to develop a creative career
What does it mean to build a creative life — especially when the rules keep changing? In this episode, Josh and Yancey reflect on the nonlinear paths of creative careers, from publishing forgotten essays that suddenly go viral to jumping formats, industries, and identities. We talk about true norths, timestamping your work, outsider paths, and the strange long game where your weirdest traits become your biggest strengths. This is an episode about navigating the shifting terrain of creative work — and what it really takes to find your way. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit metalabel.substack.com

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