Making Coffee with Lucia Solis

Lucia

A behind the scenes look at what goes into making one of the world's favorite beverages. Lucia is a former winemaker turned coffee processing specialist. She consults with coffee growers and producers all over the world giving her a unique perspective into the what it takes to get a coffee from a seed to your cup.

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83 episodes
Updated July 27

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Jul 14, 2020 · 57 min
#22: Terroir—Part II: Yeast, Bacteria & Transparent Coffee Processing
Welcome to the next installment of terroir in coffee. This one little word contains a whole world of history and has an important role in the economic viability of certain agricultural products. After the last episode I heard from some of you who wished I had talked about soil minerals and plant nutrition from soil. Others also asked about the wine making regions like Bordeaux where Terroir is regulated by french law. I cover both of these concerns in todays episode before we get to discuss what I really wanted the episode to be about: microbes and morality. There is an unspoken understanding that products that express terroir are more moral than others. I wanted to give you an episode that focused on microbiology, that talked about the yeast and bacteria that contribute to a "taste of place" but I couldn't do it without including the human perception that products that express terroir, products that are "transparent" are superior. I think we need to be really careful because science doesn't support this view. Any moral component of terroir is a choice to see it through a religious and political lens. I want to challenge your views on "transparency" and "intrinsic quality". To pick future podcast topics, get access to the scientific papers, ask questions that I answer on the podcast, and help me continue making episodes: consider supporting the show by Joining Patreon Here Mentioned on the podcast: The historical origins are from the book Terroir and Other Myths of Winegrowing by Mark A Matthews. How to Use a Pressure Chamber Demeter Fragrance Library Support the show
Jun 30, 2020 · 42 min
#21: Terroir—Part I: The Soil, The Science & The Human Element
I'm so excited for you to join me in this discussion about terroir. Terroir comes from latin, for terra - soil. Also translated as land, or “taste of the land”. Terroir is predominantly a wine concept, so why are we even talking about it in reference to coffee? If you’ve listened to other episodes, you’ll know that there are certain concepts that the coffee industry likes to borrow from the wine industry. We’ve talked about some of the really bad ones, like using wine or beer tanks to ferment coffee or how a Q grader is not like a sommelier. From the outside we see the concept used in wine to justify the high prices of a French wine, perhaps we associate it with valuing the land, a sense of place. We know it’s connected to soil, so maybe we assume that terroir also has to do with soil health. This makes terroir seem like it would be a positive concept to adopt. I see how tempting it is to think that coffee could benefit from adopting this way of speaking about coffee farms and how it can help sell the coffee beverages at higher prices. Also, it sounds so romantic, and the specialty coffee industry loves romance. But similar to my argument about “anaerobic fermentation”, terroir faces a similar problem- the word is vaguely understood at best, and then repeated and made familiar by sheer repetition, not by true understanding. Many of us have a hard time defining this word if we are asked. I have made this episode to give you a background into the origins of the word so that before we dive head first into regular use in the coffee industry, we have a better understanding of what it means. While most student of winemaking take terroir for granted, as a given, I was lucky that one of my UC Davis professors challenged the idea. The historical origins are from the book Terroir and Other Myths of Winegrowing by Mark A Matthews. I highly recommend this book for those wanting to go deeper after today's episode. To pick future podcast topics, get access to the scientific papers, ask questions that I answer on the podcast and help me continue making episodes: consider supporting the show by Joining Patreon Here Thanks to Patron Brodie for casting the deciding vote! Support the show
Jun 16, 2020 · 39 min
#20: Listener Q&A: Slow vs Fast Fermentations, Adding Foreign Yeast, & Post Harvest Effect on Density
Have you ever wondered what would happen if you introduced foreign yeast and bacteria into a coffee farm? Or maybe you're curious if we can speed up a long fermentation by warming it up. How does post harvest processing affect the density of the seed? In today's podcast episode I’m answering listener questions like these and also sharing how I approach designing a fermentation. When I was planning this podcast I knew that I wanted it to be a community supported project and that I did not want to rely on advertisements or sponsors that can be annoying or distracting to the information I want to share. The Patreon supporters are a group of individuals who care about coffee education and support me and this project. They made a monthly pledge to help keep this information free and available to everyone. With their help I can pay for equipment upgrades like a better microphone, I can pay the subscriptions for the editing software I use and cover the monthly hosting fees. Their contribution also allows me to take some time away from consulting so I can document and record these episodes. As part of their membership, Patrons submit questions—often I answer them privately in the message chats but today I wanted to share and record some of them here on the podcast so we can all learn from each other. Other resources: Christopher's Blog My UCDavis Sensory Science Professor Dr. Hildegard Heymann Producers I work with: Luiz—Fazenda California, Brazil Ana—Finca Esperanza, Guatemala Sophia—Mapache, El Salvador Andres—Cayro, El Salvador Tommy—Greenwell, Hawaii Sam—Buff, Rwanda Importers mentioned: Balzac Brothers Crop to Cup To Support this Podcast and become a Patron CLICK HERE Support the show
Jun 2, 2020 · 46 min
#19: Botanical Awareness, Tea Fermentation & Processing with Aurora Prehn
For those who know, it may not come as a surprise when I share how much I love tea. But professionally, today is the day I come out of the tea closet. I drink logarithmic levels of tea compared to coffee, and the more I confess that, the more other coffee professionals share with me that they too love specialty teas. Unfortunately I think coffee and tea are often lumped together in similar categories but they have very different histories and I think it’s worth trying to de-couple these beverages. Today's episode serves as an introduction the basics of specialty tea and will be the first of many episodes exploring the processing and history of this beverage. Our guide through the world of tea is my friend Aurora Prehn. She is a researcher of people and plants. Her undergraduate work was a double major in Anthropology and environmental studies. She worked at Rishi Tea and Botanicals as a tea educator. In 2018 she then left to do a masters in ethnobotany in Canterbury, England, which she finished last fall. Support the show on Patreon and get Aurora's curated tea flights. If you are inspired to learn more about tea check out the following resources: Tea Reading List 2020 located at worldcat.org, curated by Aurora Prehn The True History of Tea, Victor H. Mair & Erling Hoh The Tale of Tea: A Comprehensive History of Tea from Prehistoric Times to the Present Day, George L. Van Driem The Soul & Spirit of Tea, Phil Cousineau & Scott Chamberlin Hoyt (Editors) Tea: History, Terroirs, Varieties, Kevin Gascoyne, Francois Marchand, and Jasmin Desharnais Plants, Health and Healing: On the Interface of Ethnobotany and Medical Anthropology, Elisabeth Hsu & Stephen Harris (Editors) Rishi Tea & Botanicals’s Lookbook https://journal.rishi-tea.com/catalogs/ How to Store Tea, Tea Epicure https://teaepicure.com/how-to-store-tea/ US Grown Tea, Specialty Tea Alliance https://specialtyteaalliance.org/world-of-tea/us-grown-tea/ Support the show
May 19, 2020 · 31 min
#18: Anaerobic Fermentation: Building Our Coffee Vocabulary
In today's Making Coffee Podcast episode, we're taking a deep dive into anaerobic fermentation and how language reflects values. Specialty coffee is a young industry. In the consumer space we have only recently started to differentiate between processing styles like natural, washed and honey and now we’re jumping off the deep end into the microbiology of these processing styles. I wanted to record this episode because many Green Buyers ask me what Coffee Producers mean when they label their coffee like this and Coffee Producers ask me what the Green Buyers mean when they ask them for an anaerobic process. Both parties expect the other one has the answers. Even if the words are poorly understood they are still copied, pasted and repeated so much that they become familiar through sheer repetition. We see them so much that we can sometimes convince ourselves that we know what everyone is talking about, or we assume that at least they must know what they are talking about. But in my observations, it seems like at this point everyone has their individual, personal, un-scientific definition. And this is a problem because when everyone defines the words differently, we undermine the point of language to communicate. To Support this Podcast and become a Patron CLICK HERE Support the show
May 5, 2020 · 31 min
#17: Coffee Photography, Marketing and Consent
Today's Making Coffee Podcast episode is a continuation of the theme of coffee pickers and their role in quality. In the previous episode I shared my surprisingly difficult experience trying to source red ripe coffee cherry. It was surprisingly difficult to pay the farmers more for a different quality than they were used to picking because of the established system, a system that developed over decades as a response to chronically low coffee prices. It's important for me to share this with you because I don’t believe enough of us who enjoy drinking coffee realize how fragile our coffee supply is. Coffee is such a staple in our daily lives that I believe we simultaneously revere it for making our mornings more enjoyable and take it for granted. For example, many businesses offer free coffee, free coffee refills or free coffee with food. If you look around hotels, restaurants and gatherings you can often find more than 1 “FREE Coffee” sign. We expect that there will always be coffee. It seems so abundant that there is a real disconnect between the effort it takes to get that cup into our hands and what we are willing to pay for that work. Many of us would be turned off by a $5 cup of coffee but have also likely paid $15 to $20 for a glass of wine. Additionally, it's a lot less common to expect free wine. To Support this Podcast and become a Patron CLICK HERE Support the show
Apr 21, 2020 · 29 min
#16: The Elusive Search for Red Ripe Coffee Cherry
Today's episode is part 1 of a 2 part series talking about the people who pick our coffee. In episode 15 we went deeply into how a molecule of sucrose in the coffee cherry pulp becomes a flavor compound like banana or peach and gets into the coffee seed. Flavor is an accessible entry point for specialness. However, I don’t like talking about flavor and coffee too much. I don’t think coffee flavor is what’s going to help the industry move closer towards long term stability. I think it’s most often a distraction of the larger picture. My concern is the coffee farmers, the people at the source of the value chain. I think focusing on flavor distracts us from the larger threats to coffee, like climate change, pests and diseases and—what I want to talk about specifically today—availability of labor. Sitting down to collect these interactions is possible through the support of Patreon. I’m grateful for the 31 individuals who currently support this podcast and it’s through their generosity that I can make it available to you all. As a thank you, I create additional resources on the Patreon account. To Support this Podcast and become a Patron CLICK HERE Support the show
Apr 6, 2020 · 31 min
#15: How Microbes Contribute Body, Acidity, & Fruity Flavors To Your Cup of Coffee
Today's episode is very special because it was picked by the Making Coffee Podcast Patrons. I sent my patrons a poll on what they wanted to hear about next and the topic most people wanted to hear about was HOW fermentation impacts coffee flavor. How can the same yeast that makes bread rise also make my coffee taste like apricot or jasmine? Maybe you’ve thought that farmers added fruit to the coffee (and while this sometimes happens—it’s not the kind of flavor we are talking about today). Maybe you thought those flavor differences came from the different plant variety or that different countries of origin explains those differences. Those are important factors but that’s not the whole story. In this episode we will go deep into the biochemistry of how a yeast or bacteria can turn the glucose in the coffee fruit into various flavors ranging from lemongrass to mint to raspberries. There is also a question at the end about how baristas can communicate flavor in a simple way (without having to give a 30 minute science lecture) to their customers. To pick the next episode, get a copy of the scientific paper that I reference in this episode and ask questions that I answer on the podcast, check out: https://www.patreon.com/makingcoffee Support the show
Mar 11, 2020 · 53 min
#14: George Howell on Cup of Excellence, Coffee Pricing and Craftsmanship
Join me in listening to this conversation with George Howell, where we cover topics such as Cup of Excellence, coffee pricing, processing styles, craftsmanship, additives in processing, kamikaze farmers, and much more. George was awarded the Lifetime Achievement award from the SCA in 1996, even before he helped found the Cup of Excellence program in 1999. He's accomplished a lot towards improving coffee quality and educating consumers on several fronts. What I admire most is that he continues to be an advocate for quality. He's been in the industry 46 years and I was surprised to learn that he continues to travel to maintain his relationships with coffee producers, and visits Antigua every year. Even though George has had a longer career in coffee than me, and we approach coffee from different points of view and with different backgrounds, I was surprised to learn how much we have in common regarding coffee processing. Thanks for listening! Support the show
Jan 28, 2020 · 29 min
#13: Growing Up On A Coffee Farm, With Sofia Handtke of Mapache
Hello friends, Today I want to share an interview with Sofia Handtke from Mapache Coffee in El Salvador. I recorded this last November at the end of my time with them. That was my second season working with them and designing fermentation lots at their mill. Over the last 2 harvest seasons we've done about 40 different batches combining 4 strains of yeast, 3 cultivars and various lengths (# of hours in the tank) in an effort to create additional flavor options. I wanted to interview Sofia and Jan Carlo together but they have a small mill team and a lot of responsibilities so I caught them when I could. In the interview with Jan Carlo we spoke about how Mapache is embracing vertical integration, how he believes this current generation is more open to sharing information, and some of his struggles like disease pressures and how climate change has impacted his farming philosophy. You can catch my conversation with him HERE. In this conversation I ask Sofia to share her Q Grader experience and talk about her background in coffee. She believes that getting coffee producers and buyers using the same standard language is very important but unfortunately it’s still out of reach for many producers in Central and South America—this is a topic that deserves it’s own episode and it's in the works. She shares what it was like growing up in a coffee farm and how she and Jan Carlo are engaging their two teenage children to inspire them to see the coffee industry as a career option, unlike her parent’s generation, many of which had to abandon the industry because it was no longer a viable way to make a living.She shares some fantastic insights about coffee branding and marketing and the coffee gear she takes when she travels. To Support this Podcast and become a Patron CLICK HERE Support the show
Jan 21, 2020 · 25 min
#12: The Dark Side of Seeking Fresh Coffee
I'm at the halfway mark of this trip and I officially ran out of coffee. I mentioned before that a significant portion of my carry-on space was dedicated to roasted coffee. Bringing coffee from home would mean that towards the end I was drinking coffee that was about 2 months old. Generally, I don’t like to drink coffee that is over 2 months old. I don’t like stale coffee but what I’ve found is that many of us drink stale coffee. Maybe not on purpose but if you’re not actively paying attention to your coffee, I can assure you—you’re drinking stale coffee. And then we train ourselves to like it! As I mentioned in a previous episode, we prefer what is familiar. If we constantly drink stale coffee, we tend to prefer that profile. We think stale is normal. Freshness is elusive. Join me as I talk about freshness, staleness and buying coffee from producing countries. Support the show
Dec 31, 2019 · 21 min
#11: Listener Q&A: Why Ferment? Submerged vs Dry Tanks, and Can You Taste Yeast vs Bacteria?
Hello friends, In today’s podcast episode I get to do something a little different. Instead of giving you my thoughts on a particular coffee topic, I’m answering questions from 4 different listeners. Ideally I would like to have an episode for each question because they are rich with topics but many listeners have submitted questions through my website. The pile is growing quite large and I think it would be more helpful if I could keep answers brief to address a higher number of questions. Today's questions focus on fermentation, yeast, bacteria and temperature: I remain skeptical about the role and importance of fermentation on coffee quality and flavor. Would the amount of water added into the fermentation tank affect the concentration of fermentation by products found in the final product? Is fermentation temperature is largely responsible for flavor differences between submerged (in-water) and dry (out-of-water) coffee fermentations? I have always been curious as to whether it is primarily yeast or bacteria causing the fermentation inside the fruit? How would a taster know the difference between yeast and bacteria fermented coffee? Support the show
Dec 23, 2019 · 18 min
#10: What Do Coffee Producers Drink?
When most people hear that I’m going to Central America for work, they often say some variation of “how cool! you’re going to have such great coffee” which is true, but only because I haul most of if myself from The United States back to Central America in my suitcase. Consuming countries pay a higher price for good coffee - so by design the best coffee leaves the countries where it was produced. The coffee that remains is the stuff that wasn’t good enough to export and sell, so by design the locals drink the lower quality coffee. In this episode I share a story about drinking coffee with small-holder farmer that illuminated another part of the coffee quality problem. Support the show
Dec 2, 2019 · 42 min
#9: Doubling Down in El Salvador with Jan Carlo of Mapache
In this episode, I had the chance to speak with Jan-Carlo Handtke of Mapache Coffee. Jan-Carlo shares important perspectives of what it's like to be a 5th generation producer today. When most people are leaving coffee, Jan-Carlo and his wife Sofia are doubling down, buying new farms and making significant investments in education and equipment. In this conversation we talk about the role of social media, selling coffee on the local market, and he also shares some of his struggles. We talk about coffee farm irrigation, his Q-grader story, shade trees, and so much more. Support the show
Nov 25, 2019 · 18 min
#8: "Empowerment": The New Colonialism Trap
I want to start by thanking everyone who has reached out to me and sent questions/comments or just let me know that you enjoy listening. I started this podcast as my offering to chip away at the knowledge gap between coffee producers and consumers In today’s podcast episode we’re going to hear from 2 sides of the value chain in very different parts of the world. Brendan from Semilla Roasters in Canada gives the roaster perspective and later in the episode we hear from Vivek, a 4th generation coffee producer in India. He asks for advice because he’s unsure where to start. Can he learn to be a good cupper without having a Q grader license? To me, the gap is an issue because it determines power dynamics. The simple issue is: Producers who don’t cup their coffee don't have the power to improve their coffee. It’s an obvious statement but one that is frequently overlooked because it’s been the standard. Producers often rely on external parties to tell them this vital information. The buyer who is able to cup the coffees is the one who can determine the value. This alone is bad enough but I’ve seen it lead to a new disturbing trend. Since the buyers are generally more knowledgeable about the coffee’s quality and since they cup more than producers do, they are uniquely in a position to tell producers how to improve or change their coffee. Regardless of the good intentions, the buyer is dictating terms, the buyers is still the expert, the buyer has more knowledge, the buyer has more power. And I couldn’t leave this topic without talking about the word “empower” I was guilty of using this word to describe my work. It used to be part of my mission statement to “empower producers with unconventional practices”. I had that written on my profile and website. But as I discuss in this episode, that word now makes me feel uncomfortable and I’ve removed it from my website and avoid using it. After listening to today's episode, I hope you’ll consider avoiding it also. Resources Mentioned in this episode: All Beans Considered: http://allbeansconsidered.com/ Coffee Quality Institute: https://www.coffeeinstitute.org/ Luxia Presentations: https://www.luxia.coffee/instructional-videos Support the show
Nov 18, 2019 · 15 min
#7: Coffee Travel: Helping or Hurting?
I’m writing this from a hotel in the small town of Ataco, El Salvador. I’ve been away from home for 21 days out what will eventually be 120. It’s currently coffee harvest time in Central America this is the time of the year when I am traveling the most seeing clients at their mills and designing fermentation lots. This is an interesting industry because of the amount of travel required by many parties along the chain (farmers, producers, exporter, importers, roasters and cafes). All of these entities are usually located in different countries with different languages, time zones, cultures and customs. These far apart business need to work together and the best way to have a smooth business is to have strong relationships. The best way I can think of to have strong relationships is to travel and sit with each other face to face and get to know the other's culture. Unfortunately flying is a huge contributor of carbon emissions. I’ve struggled with the paradox since I started traveling heavily in 2014. At home, I am committed to reducing my environmental impact, I don’t have a car, I buy bulk foods in my own reusable containers, I compost all my food waste, Ive reduced my meat consumptions and I’ve stopped purchasing new clothes. Yet the amount of flying I do every year eclipses all the other efforts. Previous years I spent November to March alternating one week in Central America and one week at home. Sometimes even seeing 3 clients in 1 month and only being home for a handful of days. In addition to the environmental strain, there was a personal strain as well. That pace was difficult because It kept me constantly on the move and in airports, I was never home long enough to feel refreshed. There was a moment I felt like I might need to quit working in coffee because the travel was too demanding. To reduce my travel, this year I’m trying something different. Instead of going back and forth between Central America and the United States, I will stay in Central America all 4 months. My flying is dramatically reduced but not eliminated. Having such a dramatic carbon footprint is not in alignment with how I live the rest of my life, so I’m still working on how to reconcile that. Join me for today’s episode for more on this paradox and a harvest update. Support the show
Nov 11, 2019 · 27 min
#6: The Sommelier of Coffee?
You heard my experience getting my Q grader license on last weeks episode. Today’s podcast is a continuation of the Q grader discussion but focusing on its role with coffee producers. I mentioned that it’s tempting to use the wine Sommelier certification as a shorthand to describe the Q grader license because the Sommelier’s has been around much longer and its a more familiar term than Q grader. I’ve been guilty of using this shorthand in the past but its both lazy and inaccurate. I feel it's important to untangle these two tests because if we keep repeating it, eventually we will start to believe it. However tempting it is, these two certifications are different in a fundamental way. The sommelier certification is predominantly used by the service industry (restaurants, etc) and the Q grader license is used as a means of quality control for exporters, importers and roasters. The sommelier certification is consumer facing, it is not a means to improve wine production quality. There is very little overlap between a winemaker's world and a sommelier's world. In contrast the Q grader license has a significant overlap in the production and consumer worlds. I value the Q grader license and I'm glad to have a standardized method of coffee evaluation but there is one often overlooked detail that has nagged at me. Coffee producers are rarely Q graders, they are not the tasting experts, the buyers are. This means that everyone else in the value chain is more of an expert in tasting coffee than the people responsible for producing coffee. Most of us haven’t considered what it means when the consumer is more sophisticated than the producer. What kind of power dynamic is created when a specialty coffee buyer is more sophisticated than the person who is deciding the flavor profile of the coffee? I'm also curious about the system of cupping scores perpetuated with the Q grader system. Join me in today's episode as I imagine a world without coffee scores. Support the show
Nov 4, 2019 · 24 min
#5: To Be or Not To Be A Q-Grader
What is a Q Grader? In the coffee industry the Q Grader license is often compared to the sommelier exam in wine—this is a shorthand that can be useful to provide some vague ballpark approximation, but over the next 2 podcast episodes we will see how different these tests are. When I started to get serious about working in the coffee industry I was looking for ways to deepen my knowledge and the Q Grader license seemed like a good place to start. If I wanted to use fermentation techniques to improve coffee quality I would need to learn what the industry considered to be high quality. Because how can we agree on what is coffee quality, without speaking the same sensory language? To move the conversation of quality forward, I needed to differentiate between preference (coffees people like) and quality (agreed upon criteria that are independent of preference). I have definitely scored high quality coffees that were not in my preferred flavor profile—conversely just liking a coffee is not enough to qualify it as a good coffee. It needs to meet quality standards of acidity, structure, body, sweetness and balance. I believe it is important to be able to put our personal preferences in context when evaluating a coffee. Join me on today's episode as I share my experience with the Q Grader license. To take a sensory class from Alexandre Schmitt: https://www.wineandflavors.com/en/ Maybe we can revive the hashtag: #letcoffeebecoffee Support the show
Oct 28, 2019 · 21 min
#4: Over Fermentation and Brettanomyces
I find the term "over fermentation" to be especially annoying. From a biology point of view this term is nonsense. When coffee professionals use this term it's understood to mean a defect, usually vinegar, "boozy" or like rotting fruit. Everyone agrees that it's a negative trait for a coffee to have. I think it's important to be able to identify this trait but I think this label has held fermentation back and made many (producers and roasters alike) shy away from a process that when controlled can enhance coffee quality. In this week's episode I answer a listener question about double fermentation and Brettanomyces that gives me an opportunity to untangle the concept from the name we've given it. "Double fermentation" is another common colloquial phrase mistaken for a scientific label. It gives the impression that there are two fermentations, but this is not what's happening biologically. I also talk about the Russian River Brewing Company in Windsor California. I visited earlier this year in July and got to see how they use Brettanomyces and try their Brett Beer. The coffee industry is borrowing from the Beer industry as well as the wine industry and beer yeasts are becoming more popular in mills across Central America. This is an exciting time for coffee microbiology but there are a few cautions I want to give about this particular yeast. For the visually inclined: I have 3 videos that will breakdown the coffee fermentation process: https://www.luxia.coffee/instructional-videos Support the show
Oct 21, 2019 · 22 min
#3: The Best Cup of Coffee I've Ever Had
If you made it through last week's deep dive about how we talk about and label specialty coffee - you've earned your coffee-nerd badge! This week I want to pull back the lens and talk more broadly about quality and value. Instead of examining the rigidity of microbiology, this week's episode explores the subjective side of preference and what makes something "good". I tell you a little about my coffee tasting history and share the story of the best (and worst) cup of coffee I've ever had. Support the show