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High Capacity

Kyle Chan

A podcast about China, technology, and geopolitics. In-depth conversations with experts on AI, robotics, EVs, clean tech, biotech, etc. Hosted by Kyle Chan, Fellow at Brookings and author of the High Capacity newsletter.

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  • 21 episodes
  • fortnightly
  • Avg 59 min
  • English

Episodes 21

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  • Saturday · 45 min

    Competing with China at the Tech Frontier: Space, Quantum, Data, and Supply Chains

    How fast is China moving in space and quantum? Where else is China competing with the US at the technological frontier? In this episode of the High Capacity podcast, I talk with Michael Kuiken, vice chair of the US-China Economic and Security Review Commission, and Commissioner Leland Miller about US-China competition in space, quantum technology, data, and critical supply chains. We explore China’s push into reusable rockets and satellite constellations, why quantum competition extends far beyond computing, and how Beijing is turning data into an economic and strategic asset. We also discuss hidden supply chain vulnerabilities and where the US government may need to step in. We discuss: • How quickly is China advancing in reusable rockets, launch infrastructure, and alternatives to Starlink? • What are the differences between quantum computing, sensing, and communications—and where does China stand? • What could quantum breakthroughs mean for encryption, medical imaging, and military capabilities? • Why is China treating data as an asset, and how is AI making everyday information more strategically valuable? • Where are the hidden Chinese chokepoints in pharmaceuticals, semiconductors, and other critical supply chains? • How should the US rethink industrial policy and national security in a competition with no finish line? Links: US-China Commission’s 2025 Annual Report to Congress: https://www.uscc.gov/annual-report/2025-annual-report-congress Space hearing: “The Rocket’s Red Glare: China’s Ambitions to Dominate Space” https://www.uscc.gov/hearings/rockets-red-glare-chinas-ambitions-dominate-space Report: “Vying for Quantum Supremacy: U.S.-China Competition in Quantum Technologies” https://www.uscc.gov/research/vying-quantum-supremacy-us-china-competition-quantum-technologies Data hearing: “Taking a Bigger Byte: China’s Expanding Strategy for Data Dominance” https://www.uscc.gov/hearings/taking-bigger-byte-chinas-expanding-strategy-data-dominance Report: “The People’s Republic of Data: How China Is Turning Data into Capital” https://www.uscc.gov/research/peoples-republic-data-how-china-turning-data-capital Supply chains hearing: “Dominance by Design: China Shock 2.0 and the Supply Chain Chokepoints Eroding U.S. Security” https://www.uscc.gov/hearings/dominance-design-china-shock-20-and-supply-chain-chokepoints-eroding-us-security For episode transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter: https://www.highcapacity.org/ Kyle Chan on Twitter / X: https://x.com/kyleichan

  • October 17 · 50 min

    What's Driving China's Robot Revolution? Precision Components, Industrial Crossover, AI and Data

    China’s robots can dance and run marathons—but can they do useful work? And can China make the core components like actuators, reducers, and chips? In this episode of the High Capacity podcast, I talk with Sunny Cheung, a fellow in China Studies at the Jamestown Foundation, about China’s push into humanoid robots and physical AI. We explore how China is turning its EV supply chains into a robotics ecosystem, how state-owned enterprises create demand for robots, and where China still depends on foreign technology. We also discuss what the US and its allies can do to compete. We discuss: • How much progress has China made beyond dancing robots and impressive demonstrations? • Why are Chinese EV companies moving into humanoid robotics? • How do state-owned enterprises help robotics companies scale production and gather training data? • Which components can China produce domestically—and where does it still rely on Japan, Germany, and the US? • Can world models and simulation provide enough data to train useful robots? • Could general-purpose AI models like Fable or Astra end up powering the next generation of robotics? • How can the US and its allies build competitive robotics supply chains? Links: Sunny Cheung at the Jamestown Foundation: https://jamestown.org/analyst/sunny-cheung/ DSET report: “The Age of Robotics: China-West Competition and Taiwan’s Indispensable Role in the Non-Red Supply Chain” https://dset.tw/en/research/000500-1/ Wilson Center: “The Deployment Gap: Why America Risks Losing the Robotics Race” https://acrosskarman.wilsoncenter.org/article/deployment-gap-why-america-risks-losing-robotics-race Jamestown Foundation: Embodied Intelligence: The PRC’s Whole-of-Nation Push into Robotics https://jamestown.org/embodied-intelligence-the-prcs-whole-of-nation-push-into-robotics/ Sunny Cheung on Twitter / X: https://x.com/sunnycheungky Sunny Cheung on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sunnycheungcky/ For episode transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter: https://www.highcapacity.org/ Kyle Chan on Twitter / X: https://x.com/kyleichan

  • October 2 · 48 min

    Does China Want an AI Slowdown? How China Sees AI Risks and How They're Trying to Regulate AI

    Can the US and China agree to slow down AI development—or even agree on what counts as an AI risk? In this episode of the High Capacity podcast, I talk with Kendra Schaefer, partner and head of tech policy research at Trivium China, about China’s approach to AI safety. We discuss AI service registration, the regulatory gaps around open-weight releases and AI agents, and why Chinese policymakers may see some risks differently from their US counterparts. We also explore where US-China cooperation on AI safety might begin. Topics covered: Why China does not necessarily see regulation as a slowdown Anthropic’s calls to slow frontier AI development China’s AI service registration and safety testing process The challenge of regulating open-weight model releases AI agents, incident reporting, liability, and traceability How China assesses technical, social, and geopolitical AI risks What the US and China could discuss in an AI safety dialogue Follow Kendra Schaefer and explore Trivium Tech. You can also sign up for Trivium’s free daily brief. For episode transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter.

  • September 13 · 57 min

    Are the US and China in an AI Race? AGI vs. Diffusion, AI Risk, Bad Actors, the Case for Cooperation

    Is the U.S.–China AI competition really a winner-take-all race to AGI? Why has China embraced open-source AI? And are the biggest frontier models actually the greatest security threat? In this episode, I speak with Alvin Wang Graylin, a Digital Fellow at the Stanford Digital Economy Lab, a Senior Fellow at the Asia Society Policy Institute’s Center for China Analysis, a professor of AI and technology policy at the University of Washington, and co-author of Our Next Reality. We discuss: • China’s AI strategy and its focus on spreading AI throughout the economy • Why the “decisive strategic advantage” theory may misread the U.S.–China AI relationship • The prisoner’s dilemma, the stag hunt, and the case for cooperation on AI safety • China’s open-source AI ecosystem and the debate over open versus closed models • Why small, specialized AI systems may pose greater security risks than frontier models • How export controls may be accelerating Chinese AI innovation • China’s push into robotics, manufacturing, and physical AI • How China’s technology industry has changed over the past three decades Read Alvin’s essays, “Misdiagnosing the U.S.–China AI Race” and “The Biggest AI Models Are Not the Biggest Threats.” You can also follow Alvin on X and LinkedIn, or read his Substack, The Abundanist. For transcripts and more information, visit the High Capacity newsletter. Follow host Kyle Chan on X.

  • August 16 · 57 min

    China's Hidden AI Economy

    How do users in China get access to Claude and ChatGPT through the gray market? What’s really driving China’s apparent “AI optimism”? How is China trying to deal with deepfakes and AI-generated content? In this episode, I speak with Zilan Qian, a researcher at the Oxford China Policy Lab about the hidden side of China’s AI boom, including: How Chinese users use “transfer stations” to access American AI models like Claude and ChatGPT Why Chinese users still want to use Claude and ChatGPT even though there are strong Chinese mode Why China’s apparent AI optimism is really driven by anxiety about falling behind China’s push to label AI-generated content—and the problems with watermarks, detection, and false positives Links: Zilan’s Oxford page Zilan on Substack and Twitter / X How to Buy Cheap Claude Tokens in China China’s AI optimism isn’t what it seems Labelling AI-Generated Content in China

  • July 24 · 1 hr 24 min

    The Real Story Behind China's EV Rise

    How did China build a world-leading EV industry? China didn't just pick winners. Local governments and private entrepreneurs played a critical role alongside a broader national push into batteries and electric vehicle technology. In this episode, I talk with Fengming Lu, an assistant professor at Australian National University, about China's decades-long effort to build a world-class auto industry, its pivot to EVs, and what lessons other countries might learn. We discuss: • How Chinese local governments act like VC investors • What China learned from foreign automakers like GM, Volkswagen • The rise of upstarts like Geely, Chery, and BYD • What caused a wave of Chinese EV startups like NIO, Xpeng, Li Auto • The "Hefei model" Links: • The Rise of China’s Electric Vehicle Industry: Strategic Alliances Between Local Governments and Private Capital • Fengming's personal website • Fengming on Twitter / X For transcripts and more information, check out the High Capacity newsletter. Follow host Kyle Chan on Twitter / X

  • July 3 · 1 hr 2 min

    What Explains China's Biotech Rise? Genomics, Data, and the Global Biotech Ecosystem

    Why is China’s biotech industry advancing so quickly? I talk with Abigail Coplin of Vassar College to unpack China’s biotech strategy, BGI, genomics, AI-driven drug discovery, gene therapies, biotech regulation, and what the U.S.-China biotech race means for innovation, national security, and the future of medicine. Why has China emerged so quickly as a global biotech powerhouse? What gives Chinese biotech companies an edge over their Western competitors? How did BGI become one of the world’s most influential genomics companies? Why are China’s gene and cell therapies advancing so rapidly? What should U.S. policymakers know about China's biotech industry? Links: Abigail’s academic profile Abigail’s policy paper for the Penn Project on the Future of U.S.-China Relations: “Getting Biotechnology Right: Managing Risk and Reward Between the U.S. and China in the Life Sciences” Yu Zhou and Abigail Coplin. 2022. “Innovation in a Science-Based Sector: The Institutional Evolution behind China’s Emerging Biopharmaceutical Innovation Boom.” The China Review. For transcripts and more information, check out the High Capacity newsletter. Follow host Kyle Chan on Twitter / X.

  • June 16 · 53 min

    Mythos, China, and a New Era of AI Regulation

    What happened with Anthropic's Mythos and Fable models? Why did Anthropic's approach to AI safety trigger such strong backlash? What does this mean for the future of AI regulation? What role does open-source AI play in this new era of AI control? How will this impact Chinese AI labs and open-source AI models? In this episode, I talk with Nathan Lambert, a leading expert on open-source AI. He previously led post-training at Ai2, founded The ATOM Project, and writes the popular Interconnects AI newsletter. Topics covered: - Anthropic, Mythos, Fable, and the Claude controversy - Are Anthropic’s AI safety claims sincere? - Silent degradation, trust, and researcher backlash - Open science, open-source AI, and safety - How will Anthropic's new safety features impact Chinese AI labs? - The “AGI era” of AI governance - Is open-source AI safer or riskier? - Why US developers use Chinese open-source models - What Nathan learned from visiting China’s AI labs - Are Chinese AI labs AGI-pilled?Follow Nathan Lambert: Interconnects newsletter The ATOM Project X/Twitter: @natolambert Follow Kyle Chan: High Capacity newsletter X/Twitter: @kyleichan #AI #ArtificialIntelligence #Anthropic #mythos #fable #Claude #OpenSourceAI #ChinaAI #AIGovernance #AISafety

  • May 29 · 1 hr 4 min

    Is China Getting Worried About AI?

    In this episode of the High Capacity podcast, I talk with Matt Sheehan, Senior Fellow at the Carnegie Endowment, about the next phase of the US-China AI race: AI safety, open-source models, AI agents, job displacement, and what the US and China might discuss with each other. As the U.S. and China prepare for formal talks on AI, both sides are wrestling with a fast-changing technology landscape. The U.S. is increasingly worried about frontier model risks, cyber threats, non-state actors, and pre-release testing. China, meanwhile, is becoming more concerned about AI’s impact on jobs, social stability, political control, and the rise of autonomous AI agents. We discuss what China really fears about AI, why Beijing’s AI governance strategy is shifting from control to deployment to broader regulation, how open-source AI might complicate safety talks, and what realistic US-China talks on AI might look like. Topics covered: U.S.-China AI talks, AI safety, Chinese AI policy, AI agents, OpenClaw, open-source AI, frontier models, cyber risk, AI job displacement, China’s AI regulations, autonomous weapons, AI hotlines, and the future of AI governance. Links: - Matt Sheehan’s Substack - Matt Sheehan’s Carnegie page - “China is getting worried about AI & jobs” - “China Is Worried About AI Companions. Here’s What It’s Doing About Them.” - Matt Sheehan on Twitter: @mattsheehan88 For transcripts and more, check out the ⁠High Capacity newsletter⁠ More about the host, Kyle Chan, fellow at Brookings

  • May 22 · 56 min

    How China is Rewriting the Rules of AI Healthcare with Dr. Ruby Wang

    China’s biotech and healthcare sectors are evolving at extraordinary speed — from AI-powered “doctor avatars” and digital health super apps to a wave of Chinese drug innovation reshaping the global pharmaceutical industry. In this episode, I speak with physician and healthcare strategist Dr. Ruby Wang about the latest trends in China's AI + healthcare innovation.We discuss: Why Western pharma companies are rushing to license Chinese drugs China’s rise as a global biotech powerhouse AI doctors, digital hospitals, and health super apps The role of Alibaba, Ant Group, and DeepSeek in healthcare Why China’s healthcare digitization is moving faster than the West The future of AI in medicine and diagnosticsChinese medical devices, robotics, and healthcare hardware How Chinese regulators accelerated biotech innovation Whether healthcare can become China’s next major global export industry The challenges China still faces in healthcare access and inequality Ruby Wang is a UK-trained physician, founder of China Health Pulse, and author of the upcoming book China Cure, which explores the global impact of China’s biotech and AI healthcare advances. Links: China Health Pulse newsletter and podcast: https://www.chinahealthpulse.com/ For transcripts and more, check out the ⁠High Capacity newsletter⁠: https://www.highcapacity.org/ More about the host, Kyle Chan: https://www.kyleichan.com/

  • May 12 · 1 hr 5 min

    Is China Building the Next NVIDIA? China's Semiconductor Industrial Policy with Paul Triolo

    China is racing to build its own complete semiconductor industry, from AI chips and fabs to chipmaking tools like EUV lithography machines. I'm joined by industry expert Paul Triolo. 00:28 China’s Semiconductor Self-Reliance Push 11:50 How Huawei Became China’s Chip Champion 17:37 Huawei, SMIC, and the Fight for Fab Capacity 24:14 Can China Build Its Own EUV Lithography Machines? 36:55 DeepSeek, Huawei, and China’s AI Chip Feedback Loop 53:53 Why Chinese Tech Giants Are Designing Their Own Chips Links: American Affairs: “Innovation Under Pressure: China’s Semiconductor Industry at a Crossroads” Paul Triolo on X: @pstAsiaTech Paul Triolo's Substack: AIStackDecrypted For transcripts and more, check out the ⁠High Capacity newsletter⁠. Hosted by Kyle Chan

  • April 28 · 1 hr 11 min

    China and AI Supply Chains with TP Huang

    In this special crossover episode, I talk with TP Huang about the broader AI supply chain beyond just models and chips. We cover the new DeepSeek V4 model and China’s efforts to integrate with domestic AI chips. We talk about energy infrastructure, like inverters and transformers. And we discuss the robotics supply chain and how this overlaps with smartphones, EVs, and other industries in China. Note: TP Huang is not on video, just audio. 00:00 Intro 01:13 DeepSeek V4 and Huawei chips 13:01 Hardware and Infrastructure Bottlenecks 21:03 Energy supply chain 29:58 Edge AI and small models 35:14 Embodied AI and robotics 39:14 China's robotics supply chain 45:43 Different tech paths 53:32 Commercializing scientific advances 58:44 Personal journeys in China tech Links: Follow TP Huang on Twitter / X TP’s Substack and China Tech Talk podcast For transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter. I'm your host, Kyle Chan, a Fellow at Brookings.

  • April 7 · 48 min

    Z.ai: Inside a Top Chinese AI Lab

    This episode, I talk with Zixuan Li at Z.ai, one of China's top AI labs and the company behind the popular GLM models. Zixuan is Z.ai's Director of Product for genAI strategy and global partnerships. We discuss Z.ai's newest flagship AI model, the challenges of building agentic AI models, and what their longer AI strategy looks like. 00:00 Intro to Zixuan Li of Z.ai 00:29 GLM-5.1, Z.ai's Newest Flagship Model 04:34 Long Horizon Tasks 08:33 GLM Family of Foundation Models 14:30 Challenges in Developing Agentic AI Models 19:37 Working with Chinese AI Chipmakers 22:53 Open Source vs. Proprietary Models 36:49 Life After IPO and Chasing AGI 41:37 Z.ai's Global Strategy Links: Z.ai GLM-5.1: Towards Long-Horizon Tasks Zixuan on X/Twitter For transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter.

  • April 1 · 57 min

    China's Tech Strengths & Weaknesses with Rui Ma

    Rui Ma, founder of Tech Buzz China, explains the real sources of China's tech strengths and where the US still has the advantage. From industrial parks to capital markets, we talk about how to understand China's tech landscape at a deeper level -- and why so many people are eager to tour Chinese factories.Links: Tech Buzz China Tech Buzz China newsletter Rui Ma on X / Twitter For transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter

  • March 10 · 1 hr 4 min

    How China is Riding the Open Source Wave with Kevin Xu

    From DeepSeek to Kimi, China's open-source AI models have gotten all the attention. But open source has a much longer history in China, according to Kevin Xu, former head of global expansion strategy at GitHub. Kevin takes us on a journey through China's open source evolution, from its grassroots beginnings to its central role today in China's AI strategy. We also get into the current OpenClaw craze in China and why Chinese tech firms seem to be jumping in faster than their American peers. 00:00 Intro to Kevin Xu 04:21 Early days of Chinese open source 16:11 1024 Programmers' Day and 996.ICU 27:33 Huawei enters the game 41:57 DeepSeek moment 51:17 China's OpenClaw frenzy 56:40 Will China keep doing open-source? Links: Chinese Open Source: A Definitive History Kevin Xu's Interconnected newsletter Interconnected Capital Kevin Xu on Twitter / X For transcripts and more, check out the High Capacity newsletter

  • February 26 · 1 hr 9 min

    Are There Tech Bros in China? China's Tech Culture with Afra Wang

    What's China's tech culture really like? Are there billionaire tech founders? Are they worshipped like they are in the US? What inspires Chinese tech entrepreneurs? 00:00 Intro to Afra Wang 00:33 What is Chinese tech culture? 09:04 China's 4 tech generations 20:25 China's tech founders and the government 25:42 China's tech canon 44:12 Chinese sci-fi and tech culture 50:43 Chinese ideas of industrial power Links: - Concurrent newsletter - Afra's professional website - Wired: You've Never Heard of China's Greatest Sci-Fi Novel - Asterisk: The China Tech Canon - Afra on Twitter / X Transcripts and more on the High Capacity newsletter

  • February 12 · 1 hr 1 min

    China's Robotaxis and Autonomous Driving with Lei Xing

    A deep dive into China's robotaxi and autonomous driving industry. What are the big trends? Who are the major players? LiDAR vs. camera-only? How good are Chinese robotaxis? Where are they going next? I'm joined by China EV and AV expert Lei Xing in this episode of the High Capacity podcast. 00:00 Intro to Lei Xing 01:06 Smart driving vs. autonomous driving 06:37 Chinese government policy for autonomous vehicles 13:44 What's it like to ride a Chinese robotaxi? 19:29 China's different robotaxi strategies 29:30 Huawei as a major player 35:11 AI and autonomous driving in China 41:25 Semiconductor chips and smart driving 47:21 Shifting geopolitical landscape 53:40 Commercial trucking and delivery robots Follow Lei Xing: Twitter / X LinkedIn YouTube China EVs & More podcast For transcripts and more episodes, check out the High Capacity newsletter.

  • January 29 · 58 min

    China's AI Ecosystem with Grace Shao

    China's top AI players like Alibaba, ByteDance, and Moonshot are pursuing different strategies. China AI expert Grace Shao joins me on the High Capacity podcast to talk about the most important trends in China's AI landscape: agentic AI, ecosystem integration, raising capital, and navigating geopolitics. 00:00 Intro to Grace Shao 03:51 Agentic AI in China 17:42 The popularity of ByteDance's Doubao app 23:11 China's AI tigers 28:42 Shifts in China's AI strategy 34:32 Meta's acquisition of Manus 40:43 Singapore as a geopolitical gateway for AI 50:12 Future trends in China's AI industry Links: AI Proem newsletter Differentiated Understanding podcast High Capacity newsletter

  • January 15 · 1 hr 1 min

    China's EV Boom with Tu Le

    Chinese EVs are transforming the global auto industry. Tu Le, founder and Managing Director of Sino Auto Insights, joins me on the High Capacity podcast to talk about what's happening with Chinese EVs: technology and features, global expansion, new approaches to manufacturing, hybrids, and robotaxis.00:00 Introduction to Tu Le00:56 Cool Technology in Chinese EVs05:16 Chinese EVs at CES in Las Vegas07:18 Geely's Ambitious Plans for the US Market09:50 Who are the Major Chinese EV Players?17:07 Are EVs like Consumer Electronics?25:16 Manufacturing Changes in the Auto Industry29:05 Overcapacity and Chinese EVs31:43 Overcapacity and Global Implications37:33 Partnering with Chinese EV Makers44:12 The Future of Hybrids and the EV Transition50:18 The Rise of Robotaxis and Autonomous Driving Links: Sino Auto Insights SAI Newsletter China EVs & More podcast At the Wheel podcast Subscribe to the High Capacity podcast on YouTube, Spotify, or Apple Podcasts. Read the High Capacity newsletter Follow Kyle Chan on Twitter / X

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