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Experiencing Data w/ Brian T. O’Neill

Brian T. O’Neill from Designing for Analytics

Does the value of your insights, analytics, or automated intelligence product sometimes feel invisible to buyers and users? Does your product have impressive analytics and AI technology, but user adoption and sales still are not where you want them to be?

While it has never been easier to build data-driven products, why does it still seem so hard to build indispensable data products that users can't live without?

I’m Brian T. O’Neill, and on Experiencing Dataa Listen Notes top 2% global podcast — I help founders and B2B software product leaders close the Invisible Intelligence Gap through solo episodes and interviews with CEOs, founders, and the enterprise data leaders who buy their solutions  

If you’re building analytics, BI, or automated intelligence (AI) products, this non-technical show will help you better connect your product to outcomes, value, and the human factors that still matter — even in the age of AI.

Most of your competitors are still trying to compete focused on agentic AI, better analytical technology, and features. I’ll show you how delighting users and executive buyers with better product design creates a solution your customer can’t live without.

Subscribe today on all major platforms or browse the episode archive.

Get 1-Page Episode Summaries In your Inbox:
https://designingforanalytics.com/ed

About Brian:
https://designingforanalytics.com/bio/

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  • 20 episodes
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  • Avg 36 min
  • English
  • #202
    September 2 · 31 min

    202 - Surface Tension: The 5 Essential Control Surfaces to Make Your Analytics Product Sell Itself

    What makes an analytics or intelligence product indispensable when technical sophistication alone isn’t enough to drive adoption, renewals, or sales? Why do POCs stall, why does adoption stay flat, and why aren’t prospects nearly as excited about your (impressive) analytics tech as you are? It’s that the value never becomes obvious to the humans in the loop who do the buying, using, and justifying. In this episode, I provide a framework for identifying the personas (roles) and experiences that can turn sophisticated analytical capability into perceived value. We’ll explore the five essential control surfaces you’ll need to address in your product and why founders and product leaders need to look beyond technical development (e.g., the delivery of AI models, dashboards, MCP connectors, agentic capabilities, and traditional interfaces). I also examine the tensions that can emerge when incentives and goals for end users are not aligned with those of management and executive/fiscal buyers. Why does the efficiency ROI you sell to a management champion get read as a job threat to the operator/user whose adoption you need to succeed? I’ll answer this, plus the reasons AI can complicate those dynamics, how to prevent your product from creating an Invisible Intelligence Gap for customers, and why one past podcast guest’s “shipping the meter” matters much more than another feature. (That will also explain why I don’t think dashboards are dead in the age of AI.) Highlights / Skip to: Short-term stakeholders you shouldn’t forget to satisfy (particularly during POCs/Demos) such as legal, compliance, and the game of defense “value be damned” they are playing (4:14) Not every mouth is equally hungry: deciding which personas deserve the most product attention (8:23) End users of your product such as developers, analysts, business users (often ICs) operating your product daily—and why the real bar is whether they would complain to the C-suite if your product went away (9:12) How managers of ICs (e.g., sales directors, customer service managers, VPs of data, etc.) might need something very different than end users, and why the manager’s needs might be a threat to those very IC users. The 3-part fix? Making all parties look successful to their superiors; improving the lives of those stakeholders; and arming champions with the evidence fiscal buyers need (11:08) The unique needs of executive and financial stakeholders who might have the most decision power while using your product the least (15:59) Why “shipping the meter” and the Invisible Intelligence Gap decide whether your product survives the next budget cut (17:07) The “AI Agent” as a “user” of your product: Why I think agents ride in a sidecar attached to humans and what you need to do to enable your customers and their AI agents to be successful (21:23) Why figuring out what control surfaces/UIs/UXs you may need to improve is the easy part if you know what they are a response to (26:37) Links 197 - Agentic AI Isn't a Moat for Analytics Products.This is. - My episode on viable moats for BI/Analytics products in the age of AI The Invisible Intelligence Gap Behavioral Signals CEO Rana Gujral on “Shipping the Meter” is in Episode 198 Need help identifying the 5 control surfaces in your product and satisfying the human users behind them? Schedule a free discovery call with me

  • #201
    August 18 · 29 min

    201 - What Enterprise Buyers Really Want from Analytics Software Companies with David Krauza

    Recently, I met David Krauza, VP of Enterprise Data Strategy and Products & Governance at Comcast, at the 2026 CDOIQ symposium, and after chatting for a bit, he agreed to come on the show to talk about how he, as an enterprise buyer, thinks about B2B software purchases in the age of AI. As vibe coding makes internal development more accessible, David explains why the buy-versus-build decision isn’t simply about whether a company can build a solution itself. Leaders need to weigh long-term roadmaps, maintenance, integrations, and whether they want to take on the responsibility of becoming a software company. The real question is not just what can be built, but what makes the most strategic sense to own. David also highlights an important consideration vendors frequently overlook: the data their own products create and the possible importance of that to an enterprise data leader. This is particularly true when the product’s primary intended purpose is not analytics itself. In a complex sales environment, which may include a senior data leader as a champion or decision maker, product metadata, or what you might currently be thinking of as a byproduct, might actually be a primary decision point in an enterprise purchasing conversation. David then outlines the pre-implementation work required before any of this can be evaluated: establishing shared definitions, explicit success metrics, and a documented “before-picture” you can run at renewal time to understand the ROI of the product. We also explored the hidden costs that can undermine an otherwise compelling product. A polished UI may still create UX friction if users have to constantly move between systems, while complex data integrations can introduce additional labor and operational burdens. This friction should be considered during the evaluation rather than discovered after development. David says vendors can stand out by demonstrating that they understand where a customer’s business is headed and how their roadmap supports that direction. He also dropped some real gold about the difference he sees as a buyer when being pitched by a founder vs. a B2B salesperson—and what the latter is missing when they pitch him. Highlights / Skip to: Why buy any products when AI allows you to build them yourself? (2:03) Allowing use cases and goals to dictate the adoption of internal solutions (4:03) Making data capture, accessibility, and ecosystem fit part of the buying decision (5:54) Is data missing in sales conversations due to a lack of marketing or of results? (8:36) Comcast’s method for deciding to renew when the intelligence is invisible (11:22) The importance of pre-post analysis when making a renewal argument (14:02) Where David sees the most time being wasted in the pitch process and why vendors who did _____ win more often (16:36) The hidden costs that often go undiscussed during the sales process (20:07) How Comcast evaluates UX friction (back-and-forth of switching between applications to accomplish work) (22:22) Other hidden factors that can prevent your sale from closing (25:13) Differences David sees between founder-led sales and sales-led sales (26:41) David’s advice for founders selling in the analytics and data space right now (28:14) Links David Krauza’s LinkedIn David Krauza’s Substack

  • #200
    August 5 · 47 min

    200 - VC Lessons on GTM, Product, and Moats for Data and Security Startups with Nishkam Prabodh

    I'm talking to Nishkam Prabodh of Venture Guides, an early-stage venture capital firm focused on infrastructure software, cybersecurity, and data. Nishkam explains why strong technology alone rarely determines whether a startup succeeds. Many technical founders struggle when transitioning from founder-led sales to a repeatable go-to-market motion because the founder's deep customer understanding often does not translate into a scalable sales process. The challenge isn't just building better technology, but connecting technical capabilities to clear business outcomes. Nishkam breaks down the communication gap that often appears between technical products and enterprise buyers. Rather than focusing only on technical outputs, products need to demonstrate business value through experiences designed for different stakeholders, including end users, executives, compliance teams, and budget owners. Whatever ROI the product shows has to relate back to improving revenue, reducing cost, or reducing risk. Nishkam also discusses how AI is changing product organizations, with execution-focused tasks becoming increasingly automated while judgment, domain expertise, and strategic decision-making become more valuable. On buy versus build, he notes that two-thirds of the failures in the MIT study on enterprise AI deployments were internal builds, while the successes skewed toward buying. While traditional advantages like proprietary technology and architecture still matter, he believes the strongest defensibility increasingly comes after deployment. Products that learn customer context, retain institutional knowledge, improve workflows, and generate organization-specific intelligence can create compounding value over time. AI models may become commoditized, but the surrounding product layer of memory, retrieval, context, tooling, and governance will determine long-term differentiation. He closes with the discipline that makes all of this possible: pick one customer, one industry, one revenue band, and build repeatability there before worrying about coverage. Highlights / Skip to: The pattern Nishkam Prabodh sees in B2B and data companies that stall at founder-led sales handoff (4:46) Challenges in translating technical complexity into commercial clarity (7:58) The two fall-off points in a deal, and why the cheaper one is the bigger one (12:19) The importance of communicating value to the executive buyer, not just the user, as early as you can (13:24) Why a stalled deal might be a product design problem, not a sales problem (17:22) The only three things ROI is allowed to reduce to: revenue, cost, risk (19:41) What skill sets Nishkam thinks are essential for product teams (20:11) The three shifts in product hiring: later, more judgment, domain over generalist (25:37) The importance of judgment in preventing unmet needs from derailing sales (26:32) What Nishkam believes are strong moats for data products (31:13) Why a buyer's failed in-house build still costs you sales cycle and ACV (33:37) Showing the value of a product on day thirty, not just day one (36:45) Why the buyer never sees the work that makes the simplicity possible (41:20) Nishkam Prabodh’s closing advice for technical founders of analytics and data products (44:46) Links Nishkam Prabodh’s LinkedIn Venture Guides website

  • #199
    July 21 · 50 min

    199 - Why Your Analytical AI Product Might Need 2 Pitches, Not 1, with Bhaskar Sunkara, CEO (bicycle.ai)

    I’m talking to Bhaskar Sunkara, CEO of bicycle.AI, which provides an AI analyst product designed to monitor revenue-critical KPIs, investigate the business and technical drivers behind KPI changes, and take a “governed next step.” Bhaskar explains why analytics products often fail when they overwhelm users with telemetry instead of focusing on the signals that matter. Drawing from his experience as founding CTO of AppDynamics, he shares how his team moved from low-level technical monitoring to business transactions like logins, checkouts, and bookings. The key lesson? Start with the right metric at the right level of granularity, then use deeper technical analysis to explain why something changed. Bhaskar also breaks down how bicycle.AI serves multiple audiences inside an enterprise. Business leaders want measurable outcomes, KPI owners need answers about what changed and what to do next, and data teams require trust, governance, and traceability. He explains how, in order to support these different users, Bicycle separates product experience into four core surfaces: pull features like dashboards and chat, and push features like alerts and data stories. Alerts further help operational users respond quickly to KPI changes and data stories provide executives with strategic narratives around trends, causes, and business impact. During our chat, Bhaskar also draws a line most AI products blur: be explicit about which findings are deterministic and which are only a theory. He connects this directly to my CED framework, separating the conclusion from the evidence from the underlying data, and argues that how much you automate should be governed by one question: how costly is being wrong? I also probed Bhaskar about their moat. He’s learned that enterprise adoption requires winning over both executives who care about revenue impact and analytics teams that need confidence in the system’s recommendations. Bhaskar also explains why their long-term advantage comes from the DEAL framework: Detect, Explain, Act, and Learn. By continuously incorporating validated decisions, business context, and customer-specific knowledge, the platform becomes more useful over time. We finish up with his advice for fellow analytical AI product founders, including why AI makes user experience more important, not less: it is the connection between agents, decisions, humans, and accountability. Highlights / Skip to: Making the invisible feel urgent enough for customers to buy products (2:41) How to avoid creating the ‘metrics toilet’ when the system can do so much (6:56) Designing for the end-user versus the buyer, especially during the POC phase (12:20) Thinking about the product’s design in a way that ensures Bicycle’s business value is obvious (15:38) How bicycle.AI’s “push” and “pull” features help stakeholders see value (20:54) Getting their first 20 customers (25:19) What Bhaskar got wrong: over-rotating on the business buyer vs. the analytics team (32:23) The homework a build-anything horizontal platform imposes on customers (and Bicycle’s vertical antidote) (34:30) Bicycle.AI’s moat: compounding institutional knowledge (36:08) DEAL: Detect, Explain, Act, and Learn (40:46) How they designed the UX to reduce time-to-value during onboarding/setup (44:51) Bhaskar Sunkara’s advice for other analytical AI founders (and why AI makes UX even more important to address) (47:47) Links bicycle.ai Bhaskar Sunkara’s LinkedIn My CED framework for advanced analytics products that Bhaskar references in this episode

  • #198
    July 7 · 49 min

    198 - Ship the Meter: Making Invisible AI Legible to Buyers with Rana Gujral

    Today, I'm talking to Rana Gujral, CEO of Behavioral Signals, which provides AI that interprets human behavioral cues in speech to help route call center conversations more effectively, improve customer service performance, and detect voice-based fraud. Their moat is a decade of voice data tied to real business outcomes, not the model itself, as Rana explains. During our conversation, Rana shares his practical framework for making the value of their AI obvious to the various humans in the loop that the product needs to “touch,” and he argues that a one size [UI] doesn’t fit all. In Rana’s product, they discovered that customer service reps need ambient assistance, supervisors need aggregate patterns, compliance teams need audit trails, and executives need outcome metrics tied to business results. He also explains why having measurable ROI isn't enough. Early renewals for Behavioral Signals suffered because the people signing the checks couldn't actually see the product's impact. Rana's solution? “Ship the meter” alongside the intelligence. If your AI works quietly in the background, you still need reporting UIs that clearly communicate the product’s value. For founders struggling with stalled POCs, Rana breaks down the three-stage evaluation journey his team developed after repeatedly seeing deals fail at predictable moments. By designing the customer experience around those milestones, his team transformed how buyers gained confidence throughout the evaluation process. Finally, we explored why great B2B AI products don't succeed by becoming another dashboard. Rather, they succeed by closing the loop between decisions, outcomes, and learning. Rana also fills me in on his upcoming book, The AI Instinct, which focuses on how AI changes human judgment rather than simply advancing model capabilities. And his parting advice? Listen to find out! Highlights / Skip to: Making “invisible AI” value clear (3:57) The four surfaces of visibility the product team dials into to ensure Behavioral Signals is indispensable to customers(6:26) Behavioral Signals’ intentionality behind their three-phase model to address deals not closing (15:35) How Rana’s team deals with AI moving downstream problems further upstream (19:56) Determining their product’s boundaries: when do you stop building? (22:55) Why proprietary data makes for such a good moat (24:57) What Rana would do the same and differently if he were starting over (28:45) Rana’s book: The AI Instinct: The Future of AI and Human Decision-Making (39:29) Rana Gujral’s closing advice (44:35) Links Behavioral Signals The AI Instinct: The Future of AI and Human Decision-Making Rana Gujral’s website Rana Gujral’s LinkedIn

  • #197
    June 24 · 31 min

    197 - Agentic AI Isn’t a Moat for Analytics Products. This is

    Everyone is racing to the same place chasing a limited set of buyers—how will your “AI for BI” product stand out? I've been seeing teams heavily invest in copilots, agents, semantic layers, governance frameworks, and increasingly sophisticated models, yet many still hear the same feedback from sales prospects: “We may just build this ourselves?" Or they don’t hear it, but suspect the customer is doing just that. Whether they actually can DIY the solution is the wrong question. The bigger question is *why they believe they can.* Your product may have a genuine competitive advantage, but your real challenge is that this advantage isn't obvious to buyers. The moat exists, but it is invisible. What makes this relevant is that many capabilities once considered differentiators are rapidly becoming normalized. AI copilots, agentic analytics, governed data, semantic layers, and broad integrations now appear across nearly every platform in the category. As AI accelerates development, sophisticated engineering alone becomes harder to defend as a lasting advantage. So what actually creates a durable moat if the engineering and product seems easy to copy? I explore four areas: proprietary data, trusted relationships, and products that accumulate institutional knowledge remain difficult to replicate. And finally, user experience itself as a strategy. As users increasingly access your intelligence through AI agents rather than dashboards, their experience may become the moat that competitors can't copy. Highlights / Skip to: AI for BI and analytics products is facing a race to commoditization (2:09) Common moats that everyone is using right now and why they fail (3:28) Proprietary data as a moat (9:29) Being embedded in your community as a moat (11:14) Compounding institutional knowledge as a moat (15:22) UX design asa moat even when there is little/no UI to see (18:36) Find the baseline for customer experience to build into later strategies (25:11) Actionable questions to ask your team to move forward on finding your competitive differentiation as a B2B analytics product (28:02) Links CED: A UX Framework for Designing Analytics Tools That Drive Decision Making

  • #196
    June 10 · 28 min

    196 - The Unique Challenges and Solutions to Selling API-based Analytics and Intelligence Products

    I've been seeing a recurring pattern with companies selling APIs, MCPs, data feeds, and other developer-focused AI products. While the technology is often sound if not impressive, sales momentum sometimes slows when prospects have to imagine how the product will create value in their own environment. My perspective on this is that the flexibility that makes these tools powerful can also make them harder to evaluate. Flexibility can adversely increase the Invisible Intelligence Gap, and I think certain types of AI-based solutions (LLM) may actually increase this because the boundaries of the product are often so much wider than ever before (if not invisible to the buyer). So, how to close this gap? Well, one way is to build a visual UI that showcases what’s possible with your API/feed/data solution. You take the buyer out of the conceptual space and make things concrete. So today, that’s what we dig into: when to consider adding a UI, how far you need to go with it, how you can use Copilot/AI agents to help customize these example implementations, and the benefits you might see. Highlights / Skip to: The challenges of selling API-based analytics and AI products (0:56) Why this topic matters right now (2:48) The Invisible Intelligence Gap that may be slowing your sales (3:34) Strategies for bridging the Invisible Intelligence Gap with a UI (user interface) layer (7:01) Client case study: the impact and results you may see adding a UI on top of your technical product (14:05) Signs that you should consider adding UI to your technical product (18:23) Leveraging humans’ highly developed visual system to help potential customers see the full value of your product (26:24) Conclusion (27:32) Links Invisible Intelligence Gap Azeem Azhar’s Exponential View (6/4/26 episode)

  • #195
    May 26 · 27 min

    195 - Buyers Block: Why Your B2B Analytics or AI Product's POC Didn't Close

    It’s a common pattern for teams building B2B analytics and AI products: the proof-of-concept goes well, the buyers sound excited, and everyone assumes the deal is about to close—until it quietly stalls out. The assumption is usually that sales needs to follow up harder or marketing needs more enablement material. But often, the real issue is that the product itself cannot communicate its value without humans in the room explaining it. I call this the Invisible Intelligence Gap. Buyers may understand the promise during a guided demo, but once the sales engineers leave, customers are left trying to figure out workflows, use cases, trust concerns, integrations, and organizational fit on their own. This gets even harder with broad, general-purpose AI tools and chat-based interfaces that sometimes assume users already know what to ask. The solution isn’t simply shipping more features or training content. It’s designing products that clearly reveal their value, reduce customer effort, and continue selling themselves after the POC ends, and getting that design right starts with the right product strategy. Highlights/ Skip to: First principles thinking - add sales effort or fix the product? (0:43) How the POC phase supports sales efforts (3:28) The role of the Invisible Intelligence Gap (5:38) What is “buyer’s block” and how to avoid it (6:26) Avoiding the “Two-Costs Model” and what that model is! (11:34) Overcoming a stalled sales process (13:42) Understanding the problem, users, outcomes, and boundaries (14:41) Three product strategy moves you can make (17:50) Always ask how customers are experiencing the product and if it sells itself (24:04) Links Podcast: Ep. 189 The Invisible Intelligence Gap

  • #194
    May 12 · 50 min

    194 - AI for BI: Juan Sequeda on Preparing Your Analytics to Work With LLMs

    If you’re hoping that adding AI to your analytics product or capabilities is going to unlock new revenue, sales, and greater user adoption, but you’re not sure what’s involved in this transformation, this episode is for you! Today, I’m talking with Juan Sequeda today, an expert in knowledge graphs and ontologies who most recently was Head of the AI lab at data.world, which was recently acquired by ServiceNow. Juan and I met while speaking at CDOIQ a few years ago, and after being on his former podcast “Catalogs and Cocktails.” (With a name like that, I naturally had him out to my local tiki bar while visiting Cambridge!) Talk-to-your-data products – effectively next-gen business intelligence applications – are a hot topic right now, and this has made much of Juan’s PhD work in semantics highly relevant right now as companies try to make analytics more user-friendly via natural language. Juan is clear that the starting point for this transformation isn’t the model or the UI, but actually the customer’s workflow—and that was like music to my ears! Analytics only matters when it drives action, so the real challenge is not answering more questions, but enabling better decisions and outcomes. A key theme is semantics, which, in product design language, I think of as making users’ mental models of their business or domain map logically to system and data models so that AI produces the right answers in the right context. Juan outlines a practical path to getting started with this: strong data modeling, a well-defined semantic layer, buy-vs-build considerations, and throughout, a constant focus on what the customer’s workflow and problem is. Highlights/ Skip to: Juan Sequeda’s background (2:14) Is AI for BI the way to go for proprietary analytics products? (4:30) Bolted-on AI versus transformational AI, and what customers are doing with current reporting (8:26) Knowing your product’s boundaries and when extending into adjacent customer workflows stops making strategic sense (14:46) Setting proper expectations for non-technical founders around what AI can “answer” with analytics (18:43) The role of customer problems in informing the prerequisite technology and data decisions (24:37) What's the actual lift to add chat-with-your-data capabilities to a SaaS product: data foundation, semantic layer, and the build-vs-buy call (33:38) Why Juan thinks every company should become “AI-native” (41:20) AI might theoretically make for a better analytics UX, but are users ready to change their behavior or abandon the analytics tools they use now? (46:00) How to follow Juan Sequeda (49:03) Links Catalogs & Cocktails Podcast Juan Sequeda’s LinkedIn Juan Sequeda’s Substack

  • #193
    April 28 · 24 min

    193 - Faster…or Better? Creating Value with Blue Ocean Thinking and AI-Powered Product Development

    Speed is often confused with good product thinking. The idea is that if teams can ship prototypes, dashboards, and models faster, they will automatically learn faster. But execution speed alone doesn’t ensure a clearer understanding of what’s actually worth building. Instead, teams often fall into a loop driven by demo feedback. They present working prototypes, and users respond to what they can see in the form of interface design, visualizations, or surface-level data behavior. While this feedback feels positive, it’s often misleading. Teams can end up reacting to presentation (UI) feedback only to find it does not change propensity to buy or increase user adoption. The key idea today is that prototypes can either be used to clarify the problem space and user needs or to validate the solution presented. Where I see most teams fail is that every artifact or prototype is seen as a solution to validate, and they can miss the forest for the trees. Another approach borrows from blue ocean thinking, which focuses on creating value by looking for overlooked opportunities in the empty space—beyond the known “problem space” your customer knowingly lives in now. Because AI lets us move so fast with prototyping, I think there is an exciting possibility to explore the blue-ocean spaces where your product could evolve to produce value. As always, we seek to go beyond building “technically right, effectively wrong”—which doesn’t make people buy, use, or refer your product. Today, we look at what AI can help us to do to see even farther beyond the immediate problem space. Highlights/ Skip to: Where the idea for this episode came from (00:46) Why faster building of artifacts with AI doesn’t necessarily mean faster market validation (2:09) How understanding the problem space results in fewer prototypes being created (5:40) Using blue ocean strategy to arrive at new products worth paying for (08:23) Finding missed market opportunities blocked by cost, tech limits, or risk (12:39) How AI-assisted user research fits into blue ocean thinking (14:33) The big picture: winners will figure out what’s worth building before they build it (20:42) Links Contact Designing for Analytics

  • #192
    April 15 · 46 min

    192 – Product Usage Does Not = Value: Why “Adoption” Metrics Are Misleading You

    I’ve seen this challenge again and again with teams building analytics and AI products: nobody can define what quality to the end user means or how to measure. The answer? “Adoption.” The problem is that “amount of usage” tells you nothing useful about your customer’s experience with your product beyond “it’s not zero.” So what should you be measuring instead so your buyers don’t quickly abandon once the end users get their hands on the keyboard (or agent!)? The answer is to understand through qualitative measures what users’ experiences are like now, so you have an objective baseline from which to compare future product investment. When you can define their current experience’s quality, it’s much easier to imagine their better future, and you also now have a change you can measure. Measurable outcomes are the foundation of high-value, sticky B2B analytics and intelligence products—and when your end users’ lives are improved, the sales close, and the renewals aren’t questioned. So today, I jump into “how do you measure UX?” so you aren’t surprised when the sale doesn’t close or that renewal doesn’t come through unexpectedly. Highlights / Skip to: Why I think product adoption (i.e. product usage analytics) are misleading as a means to define whether your solution is valuable to users (1:34) Getting a better baseline reading of user experience so you can improve their life and your sales/retention KPIs (4:56) How to measure, hypothesize, and observe if your product is working “well” (7:35) Discovering where your product is being appreciated (20:28) What about when AI is in the loop? (23:05) The risk of creating bigger messes with AI capabilities (28:20) How to gain useful insights from your customer exposure time (31:28) The quantitative metrics you can use to help measure UX outcomes (36:17) Why "ship it and see if it gets used" isn't a product strategy (40:52) Links More Resources Get 1x1 Help from me if you know your product’s value is opaque, or the user experience is hindering your sales or adoption goals

  • #191
    April 1 · 42 min

    191 - Turning Agents into Software that Sells [Smarter!] with Zig.ai CEO Steve Ancheta

    I'm talking with Steve Ancheta, CEO of Zig, a platform designed to free sales teams from repetitive, non-revenue-generating tasks. CRM and logistical tasks can consume up to 72% of the week of a sales team, but Zig’s AI agents handle them so reps can focus on closing deals. Unlike tools built for managers, Zig follows a rep-first design—simple, intuitive, and aligned with the motivation to sell more—while also creating an intelligence layer that preserves institutional knowledge and accelerates onboarding for new hires. I wanted to chat with Steve about how he built a product that is both used—and worth paying for—with AI under the hood. Rather than relying on chat prompts, Zig surfaces prioritized tasks in panels and cards, integrates with CRMs and Slack, and builds confidence scores from user interactions. Because Steve comes from the world of sales—and that’s the domain his product sits in—I wanted to explore his “problem clarity” and share that with you, since I often find data and technical founders to be more solution-oriented and lacking in this area. Steve was an open book with me, and I’m hoping other founders trying to turn analytical complexity into commercial clarity can see how Steve is using AI and agents to make data work for end users—and worth paying for. Finally, I also challenge Steve to answer whether Zig.ai is a software company or a services company with a product behind the scenes—a question you might also ask yourself depending on your GTM model. Highlights/ Skip to: What is Zig.ai? (00:48) When managers see the value of a product but end-users don’t—and how product leaders need to react (5:20) What Zig’s UX is like and how it was designed (9:45) The sales process and risks salespeople face when demoing Zig (16:12) How Zig addressed their time-to-value challenge during the product experience (20:14) How Zig found a problem people were willing to pay to solve (24:16) We discuss whether an AI product company might be a services company with technology or a traditional software company (24:16) The Invisible Intelligence Gap Steve has observed within Zig’s business space (AI and analytics-powered sales tooling) (27:57) Why Steve isn’t worried about the major CRMs from building internal solutions to circumvent third-party tools like Zig (35:37) Steve Ancheta’s advice for trying to bring sophisticated data products to market (39:26)

    • Transcript
  • #190
    March 17 · 43 min

    190 - Why Discovering Valuable Analytics Use Cases for Your Product Is So Hard (Even with AI)

    I’ve seen this pattern repeatedly with teams building analytics and AI products: the issue usually isn’t the quality of the models or the sophistication of the data. The technology often works just fine. The real breakdown happens earlier—when teams begin with the data they already have and try to figure out what to build, instead of starting with the decisions their customers need to make. That approach often produces polished dashboards and compelling features that generate interest, but fail to drive real action. The missing piece is context. Decisions in the real world depend on incentives, habits, risk tolerance, and uncertainty—not just clean data. If your product doesn’t reflect that reality, it won’t meaningfully change behavior. Another common trap is assuming all available data is *evidence* worth surfacing. This “more is better” mindset leads to cluttered analytics tools that offload interpretation onto users. Even conversational AI interfaces can fall into this, encouraging open-ended exploration without helping users reach decisions. The analytics and AI products that succeed take a different approach. They’re designed around decision-making to reduce uncertainty, fit into real workflows, and guide users toward clear actions. In doing so, they bridge the gap between analytical capability and real-world value, making the product’s intelligence tangible, usable, and worth paying for. Highlights/ Skip to: The core mistake I see people making during the discovery process of building an insights product (2:07) Improve your product strategy by working ‘backwards” and understanding what decisions customers are trying to make (6:06) Insights don’t equal decisions in the real world (7:39) Designing with a goal of improving the lives of users in mind (11:17) Prototypes as a means of discovery (vs. product/solution validation) (13:48) The bias of data availability (20:39) Using AI and LLMs for discovery and product UX (24:17) Why AI-assisted analytics products should shape UX around making structured decisions (31:03) Overcoming the Invisible Intelligence Gap (34:57) Final thoughts (37:21) Links CED: My UX Framework for Designing Analytics Tools That Drive Decision Making https://designingforanalytics.com/ced Need my help finding the right use cases for your analytics or AI product? Book a complimentary 1x1 discovery call with me: https://designingforanalytics.com/contact/

    • Transcript
  • #189
    March 5 · 25 min

    189 - The Invisible Intelligence Gap

    I’ve worked with a lot of teams building analytics and insights products and decision-support systems. The pattern I keep seeing isn’t that the math is wrong or the ML / AI models are weak. Much of the time, the technology is fine. The challenge is that all that [not always artificial!] intelligence is not surfacing as value to your customer. Dashboards look impressive. AI features demo well. Pilots get strong reactions. And then… usage stalls. Sales cycles drag. Teams quietly revert to spreadsheets. Buyers, or rather, prospective buyers, say they “like the vision,” but deals don’t move into the “closed” stage. If your gut tells you the primary blocker is not your sales process, pricing/packaging, procurement, data quality, or risk/compliance, then you may be suffering from what I call the Invisible Intelligence Gap. Your product’s intelligence simply isn’t visible to them. Three forces tend to amplify this gap. First, the value translation gap, which is when buyers and users can’t easily connect insights to their own goals. Second is the workflow alignment gap resulting from the product not fitting how work actually gets done. Third, the trust and control gap involves users lacking confidence in how the system reaches conclusions. My frameworks like CED, FOWA, and MIRRR are designed to close these gaps by making value obvious, workflows smoother, and AI more trustworthy. Highlights/ Skip to: The challenge of insights not providing value to buyers, end-users, and stakeholders (3:20) How the invisible intelligence gap manifests itself (6:42) Common symptoms of the invisible intelligence gap (8:10) Examples of how changes in human behavior cause the gap (10:00) The (3) amplifiers of the invisible intelligence gap (11:47) The CED framework for addressing the intelligence gap problem (18:28) Addressing the invisible intelligence gap with FOWA (20:14) Using MIRRR to solve the invisible intelligence gap (21:25)

  • #188
    February 17 · 46 min

    188 - Can’t Close the Sale? Why Your Product’s UX and Workflow Misalignment Are Killing Sales (Part 2)

    I’m continuing my exploration of a hard truth many leaders of analytics software companies run into: deals don’t stall because the tech is weak. Instead, they stall because prospects can’t see the value soon enough or the risk of changing the status quo is too high. This is often a product problem, not a sales one, and obtaining Flow-of-Work Alignment (FOWA) may help you start closing more evals and deals. So what is FOWA? The idea is simple, but demanding: stop showcasing features and start designing experiences that fit into how customers already do their work, create value, and add delight when your product is added into the loop. Getting to FOWA means tailoring demos with realistic, industry-specific data, reducing mental translation, and minimizing behavior change. In this scenario, improvements become small, testable bets tied to outcomes, not feature checklists. UX and usability are not cosmetic; they should shape trust, adoption, and buyability. When prospects can clearly see themselves succeeding with your product, value feels obvious, evals progress, and deals close. Highlights/ Skip to: Steps to implementing Flow-of-Work Alignment (FOWA): Tailor your demo or POC to map to the prospects' world and their workflow (1:53) Treat product improvements as bets that have to be tested so that observable outcomes are what you’re holding your product team accountable for (3:57) Reducing perceived behavior change (6:39) Realize that your product’s visual design are likely impacting your product’s clarity and its desirability (12:29) Aligning your sales and product teams around customer outcomes and not feature gaps (18:03) Why you might think FOWA won’t work for your product—and how to reframe those objections (24:22)

  • #187
    February 4 · 20 min

    187 - Can’t Close the Sale? The Invisible Reasons Prospects Aren’t Buying Your Technically Superior Analytics or AI Product (Part 1)

    I’m digging into a frustrating reality many teams face: even technically superior analytics and AI products routinely lose deals—not because the KPIs or models aren’t good enough, but because buyers and users can’t clearly see how the product fits into their day-to-day work. Your demos and POCs may prove what’s possible, but long time-to-understanding, heavy thinking burden on the user, and required behavior or process changes introduce risk—and risk kills momentum. When value feels complicated, sales don’t move forward. Adding to the challenge is that many sales efforts focus almost entirely on the fiscal buyer while overlooking the end users who actually have to adopt the product to create outcomes. This buyer–user mismatch, combined with status quo bias, often leads to indecision rather than change. To address this, I explore the idea of thinking about the sales challenge as a product problem—and I introduce the idea of achieving Flow of Work Alignment (FOWA). The goal isn’t better persuasion—it’s clearer value. Strong FOWA means transitioning from demonstrating capabilities to helping customers see themselves—and their workflows—represented in your demos and POCs. The result? Prospects understand your value quickly, ask deeper, contextual questions, and deals move forward. Highlights/ Skip to: Data products must work harder to expose value clearly to avoid the dreaded “closed-lost” deal stage in your CRM (1:38) Making your data product’s value instantly obvious (5:18) How the “old model” of selling based on capabilities and feature demos can lead to lost sales (7:22) What Flow-of-Work Alignment is and how it can help you unlock deals (13:02) How to know if you have achieved FOWA or not in your product and sales process (13:58)

    • Transcript
  • #186
    January 20 · 38 min

    186 - Why Powerful AI & Analytics Products Feel Useless to Buyers

    I’m back! After about 7 years (or more) of bi-weekly publishing, I gave myself a break (to have the flu, in part), but now it’s back to business! In 2026, I’ll be focusing the podcast more on the commercial side of data products. This means more founders, CEOs, and product leader guests at small and mid-sized B2B software companies who are building technically impressive B2B analytics and AI products. With all the focus on AI, I want to focus on things that don’t change: what do value and outcomes look like to buyers and users, and how do we recreate it with analytics and AI? What learnings and changes have leaders had to make on the product and UI/UX side to get buyers to buy and users to use? So, that brings us to today’s episode. Today, I’ll explain why I think model quality, analytics data, and raw AI capability are quickly becoming commodities, shifting the real challenge to how effectively companies can translate their data and intelligence into value that buyers and users can clearly understand and defend. I dig into a core tension in B2B products: fiscal buyers and end users want different things. Buyers need confidence, risk reduction, and defensible ROI, while users care about making their daily work easier and safer. When products try to appeal broadly or force customers to figure out how AI fits into their workflows, adoption breaks down. Instead, I make the case for tightly scoped, workflow-aware solutions that make value obvious, deliver fast time-to-value, and support real decisions and actions. Highlights/ Skip to: Refocusing the trajectory of the show for 2026 (00:31) Turning your product’s intelligence into clear, actionable solutions so users can see the value without having to figure it out themselves (4:32) You’re selling capability, but buyers are buying relief from a specific pain point (7:33) Asking customers where AI fits into their workflow is poor design (16:57) Buyers and users both require proof of value, but in different ways (20:05) Why incomplete workflows kill trust (24:18) The importance of translating technical capability into something a human is willing to own (30:09)

  • #185
    Dec 23, 2025 · 41 min

    185 - Driving Healthcare Impact by Aligning Teams Around Outcomes with Bill Saltmarsh

    Bill Saltmarsh joins me to discuss where a modern CDO gets the inspiration to “operate in the producty way” in his domain, which is healthcare. Now Vice President of Enterprise Data and Transformation and the Chief Data Officer at Children’s Mercy Kansas City, his early days as an analyst revealed a gap between what stakeholders asked for vs. the outcomes they sought. This convinced him that data teams need to pause, ask better questions, and prioritize meaningful outcomes over quickly churning out dashboards and reports. Bill and I discuss how a producty mindset can be embedded across an organization. He also talks about why data leaders must set firm expectations. We explore the personal and cultural shifts needed for analysts and data scientists to embrace design, facilitation, and deeper discovery, even when it initially seems to slow things down. We also examine how to define value and ROI in healthcare, where a data team's impact is often indirect. By tying data efforts to organizational OKRs and investing in governance, strong data foundations, and data literacy, he argues that analytics, data, and AI can drive better decisions, enhance patient care, and create durable organizational value. Highlights/ Skip to: What led Bill Saltmarsh to run his team at Children’s Mercy “the producty way” (1:42) The kinds of environments Bill worked in prior that influenced his current management philosophy (4:36) Why data teams shouldn’t be report factories (6:37)  Setting the standard at the leadership level vs the everyday work (10:53) How Bill is skilling and hiring for non-technical skills (i.e. product, design, etc) (13:51)  Patterns that data professionals go through to know if they’re guiding stakeholders correctly (20:54)  The point when Bill has to think about the financial side of the hospital (26:30) How Bill thinks about measuring the data team’s contributions to the hospital’s success (30:28) Bill’s philosophy on generative AI (36:00) Links Bill Saltmarsh on LinkedIn

  • #184
    Dec 9, 2025 · 14 min

    184 - Part III: Designing with the Flow of Work: Accelerating Sales in B2B Analytics and AI Products by Minimizing Behavior Change

    In this final part of my three-episode series on accelerating sales and adoption in B2B analytics and AI products, I unpack a growing challenge in the age of generative AI: what to do when your product automates a major chunk of a user’s workflow only to reveal an entirely new problem right behind it. Building on Part I and Part II, I look at how AI often collapses the “front half” of a process, pushing the more complex, value-heavy work directly to users. This raises critical questions about product scope, market readiness, competitive risks, and whether you should expand your solution to tackle these newly surfaced problems or stay focused and validate what buyers will actually pay for. I also discuss why achieving customer delight—not mere satisfaction—is essential for earning trust, reducing churn, and creating the conditions where customers become engaged design partners. Finally, I highlight the common pitfalls of DIY product design and why intentional, validated UX work is so important, especially when AI is changing how work gets done faster than ever. Highlights/ Skip to: Finishing the journey: staying focused, delighting users, and intentional UX (00:35) AI solves problems—and can create new ones for your customers—now what? (2:17) Do AI products have to solve your customers’ downstream “tomorrow” problems too before they’ll pay? (6:24) Questions that reveal whether buyers will pay for expanded scope (6:45) UX outcomes: moving customers from satisfied to delighted before tackling new problems (8:11) How obtaining “delight” status in the customer’s mind creates trust, lock-in, and permission to build the next solution (9:54) Designing experiences with intention (not hope) as AI changes workflows (10:40) My “Ten Risks of DIY Product Design…” — why DIY UX often causes self-inflicted friction (11:46) Links Listen to part I: Episode 182 and part two: Episode 183 Read: “Ten Risks of DIY Product Design On Sales And Adoption Of B2B Data Products” Stop guessing what is blocking your own product’s adoption and sales: Schedule a Design-Eyes Assessment with me, and in 90 minutes, I'll diagnose whether you're facing a design problem, a product management gap, a positioning issue, or something else entirely. You'll walk away knowing exactly what's standing between your product and the traction you need—so you don't waste time and money on product design "improvements" that won't move your critical KPIs.

  • #183
    Nov 27, 2025 · 35 min

    183 - Part II: Designing with the Flow of Work: Accelerating Sales in B2B Analytics and AI Products by Minimizing Behavior Change

    In this second part of my three-part series (catch Part I via episode 182), I dig deeper into the key idea that sales in commercial data products can be accelerated by designing for actual user workflows—vs. going wide with a “many-purpose” AI and analytics solution that “does more,” but is misaligned with how users’ most important work actually gets done. To explain this, I will explain the concept of user experience (UX) outcomes, and how building your solution to enable these outcomes may be a dependency for you to get sales traction, and for your customer to see the value of your solution. I also share practical steps to improve UX outcomes in commercial data products, from establishing a baseline definition of UX quality to mapping out users’ current workflows (and future ones, when agentic AI changes their job). Finally, I talk about how approaching product development as small “bets” helps you build small, and learn fast so you can accelerate value creation. Highlights/ Skip to: Continuing the journey: designing for users, workflows, and tasks (00:32) How UX impacts sales—not just usage and adoption(02:16) Understanding how you can leverage users’ frustrations and perceived risks as fuel for building an indispensable data product (04:11) Definition of a UX outcome (7:30) Establishing a baseline definition of product (UX) quality, so you know how to observe and measure improvement (11:04 ) Spotting friction and solving the right customer problems first (15:34) Collecting actionable user feedback (20:02) Moving users along the scale from frustration to satisfaction to delight (23:04) Unique challenges of designing B2B AI and analytics products used for decision intelligence (25:04) Quotes from Today’s Episode One of the hardest parts of building anything meaningful, especially in B2B or data-heavy spaces, is pausing long enough to ask what the actual ‘it’ is that we’re trying to solve. People rush into building the fix, pitching the feature, or drafting the roadmap before they’ve taken even a moment to define what the user keeps tripping over in their day-to-day environment. And until you slow down and articulate that shared, observable frustration, you’re basically operating on vibes and assumptions instead of behavior and reality. What you want is not a generic problem statement but an agreed-upon description of the two or three most painful frictions that are obvious to everyone involved, frictions the user experiences visibly and repeatedly in the flow of work. Once you have that grounding, everything else prioritization, design decisions, sequencing, even organizational alignment suddenly becomes much easier because you’re no longer debating abstractions, you’re working against the same measurable anchor. And the irony is, the faster you try to skip this step, the longer the project drags on, because every downstream conversation becomes a debate about interpretive language rather than a conversation about a shared, observable experience. __ Want people to pay for your product? Solve an *observable* problem—not a vague information or data problem. What do I mean? “When you’re trying to solve a problem for users, especially in analytical or AI-driven products, one of the biggest traps is relying on interpretive statements instead of observable ones. Interpretive phrasing like ‘they’re overwhelmed’ or ‘they don’t trust the data’ feels descriptive, but it hides the important question of what, exactly, we can see them doing that signals the problem. If you can’t film it happening, if you can’t watch the behavior occur in real time, then you don’t actually have a problem definition you can design around. Observable frustration might be the user jumping between four screens, copying and pasting the same value into different systems, or re-running a query five times because something feels off even though they can’t articulate why. Those concrete behaviors are what allow teams to converge and say, ‘Yes, that’s the thing, that is the friction we agree must change,’ and that shift from interpretation to observation becomes the foundation for better design, better decision-making, and far less wasted effort. And once you anchor the conversation in visible behavior, you eliminate so many circular debates and give everyone, from engineering to leadership, a shared starting point that’s grounded in reality instead of theory." __ One of the reasons that measuring the usability/utility/satisfaction of your product’s UX might seem hard is that you don’t have a baseline definition of how satisfactory (or not) the product is right now. As such, it’s very hard to tell if you’re just making product *changes*—or you’re making *improvements* that might make the product worth paying for at all, worth paying more for, or easier to buy. "It’s surprisingly common for teams to claim they’re improving something when they’ve never taken the time to document what the current state even looks like. If you want to create a meaningful improvement, something a user actually feels, you need to understand the baseline level of friction they tolerate today, not what you imagine that friction might be. Establishing a baseline is not glamorous work, but it’s the work that prevents you from building changes that make sense on paper but do nothing to the real flow of work. When you diagram the existing workflow, when you map the sequence of steps the user actually takes, the mismatches between your mental model and their lived experience become crystal clear, and the design direction becomes far less ambiguous. That act of grounding yourself in the current state allows every subsequent decision, prioritizing fixes, determining scope, measuring progress, to be aligned with reality rather than assumptions. And without that baseline, you risk designing solutions that float in conceptual space, disconnected from the very pains you claim to be addressing." __ Prototypes are a great way to learn—if you’re actually treating them as a means to learn, and not a product you intend to deliver regardless of the feedback customers give you. "People often think prototyping is about validating whether their solution works, but the deeper purpose is to refine the problem itself. Once you put even a rough prototype in front of someone and watch what they do with it, you discover the edges of the problem more accurately than any conversation or meeting can reveal. Users will click in surprising places, ignore the part you thought mattered most, or reveal entirely different frictions just by trying to interact with the thing you placed in front of them. That process doesn’t just improve the design, it improves the team’s understanding of which parts of the problem are real and which parts were just guesses. Prototyping becomes a kind of externalization of assumptions, forcing you to confront whether you’re solving the friction that actually holds back the flow of work or a friction you merely predicted. And every iteration becomes less about perfecting the interface and more about sharpening the clarity of the underlying problem, which is why the teams that prototype early tend to build faster, with better alignment, and far fewer detours." __ Most founders and data people tend to measure UX quality by “counting usage” of their solution. Tracking usage stats, analytics on sessions, etc. The problem with this is that it tells you nothing useful about whether people are satisfied (“meets spec”) or delighted (“a product they can’t live without”). These are product metrics—but they don’t reflect how people feel. There are better measurements to use for evaluating users’ experience that go beyond “willingness to pay.” Payment is great, but in B2B products, buyers aren’t always users—and we’ve all bought something based on the promise of what it would do for us, but the promise fell short. "In B2B analytics and AI products, the biggest challenge isn’t complexity, it’s ambiguity around what outcome the product is actually responsible for changing. Teams often define success in terms of internal goals like ‘adoption,’ ‘usage,’ or ‘efficiency,’ but those metrics don’t tell you what the user’s experience is supposed to look like once the product is working well. A product tied to vague business outcomes tends to drift because no one agrees on what the improvement should feel like in the user’s real workflow. What you want are visible, measurable, user-centric outcomes, outcomes that describe how the user’s behavior or experience will change once the solution is in place, down to the concrete actions they’ll no longer need to take. When you articulate outcomes at that level, it forces the entire organization to align around a shared target, reduces the scope bloat that normally plagues enterprise products, and gives you a way to evaluate whether you’re actually removing friction rather than just adding more layers of tooling. And ironically, the clearer the user outcome is, the easier it becomes to achieve the business outcome, because the product is no longer floating in abstraction, it’s anchored in the lived reality of the people who use it." Links Listen to part one: Episode 182 Schedule a Design-Eyes Assessment with me and get clarity, now.

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