
Liquid Gold bonus: All That We Touch goes to SXSW
What would it actually take to build a functioning circular economy in nutrients, starting with recycling human urine? That's the question driving this bonus episode of Liquid Gold, recorded live at South by Southwest Sydney 2025. UTS researcher Dana Cordell chairs a panel that pushes past the novelty of "wee as fertiliser" into the harder territory: phosphorus scarcity, wastewater emissions, contamination risk, and who should be paying for pollution in the first place. The conversation moves from Django Seccombe explaining why Sydney Water spends up to two billion dollars a year dealing with nutrients it could be recovering instead, to organic garlic grower Dr Michelle Zeibots on the practical "yuck factor" of getting farmers to actually use urine-derived fertiliser, to policy expert Liana Downey on why consumers so often end up carrying the cost of decisions made further up the supply chain. VOICES Kerry Tozer is a doctoral researcher at the Institute for Sustainable Futures, UTS Jordan Roods is a doctoral researcher at the Institute for Sustainable Futures, UTS Associate Professor Dana Cordell is a Research Director at the Institute for Sustainable Futures where she leads the Food Systems research group. Dana works with stakeholders across Australia, EU, UK, Sweden, Vietnam, Sri Lanka, India, China, Malawi and the U.S. to identify how food systems can transform and circularise in response to a range of sustainability challenges, from climate change to urban sprawl, to the global phosphorus challenge. Django Seccombe is an environmental engineer who splits his time between establishing and embedding circular economy practice in Sydney Water and developing cross industry circular economy projects in the private sector. His projects cut across water, energy, food and waste systems. Dr Michelle Zeibots is a garlic farmer and a researcher with UTS’ Institute for Sustainable Futures, specialising in the analysis of sustainable urban passenger transport systems. Liana Downey is an experienced strategic advisor who helps leaders change the world. As Executive Director of Liana Downey & Associates, Liana and her team work with nonprofits, governments and social enterprises globally to increase impact. She is the author of Mission Control: how non profits and governments can focus, achieve more and change the world (Routledge, 2016). Have your say Jordan and Kerry have put together a short anonymous survey to hear what listeners think about urine recycling – "peecycling"! – and the problems it could solve. The survey link is in the show notes on the episode page. Participants who share their contact details go into a draw to win one of three $50 AUD Visa gift cards. Please make sure you read the participant information sheet and complete the consent requirements before completing the survey or uploading any audio or video that could identify you. Try it for yourself You can purchase your own bottle of eco-friendly urine-derived fertiliser to sprinkle on your plants via this link: https://www.nicegreentech.com/products Further reading Turning food waste into taste From flush to fertiliser, urine is liquid gold You can find plenty of fact sheets and articles about the future of urine recycling and a circular nutrient economy at the NiCE Hub website. Credits Producer: Celine Teo-Blockey Sound Engineering: Melissa May Additional Music: Om Bhandari Cover Art: Alexandra Morris Executive Producer, Impact Studios: Sarah Gilbert All That We Touch is an Impact Studios production, made on Gadigal land in Warrane/Sydney.








